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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:46 pm 
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I received an answer finally from the FIA regarding the 22.5 rule question:

(this is the e-mail and response I received this morning I have only changed my name to my "handle" -interesting to note also that being in the US I cannot query the FIA headquarters in Europe, but have to go thru FIA in the US, they are in Colorado)

this was sent Monday Oct. 2nd, 2017

Dear FIA,

As a long time F1 fan, 63 years old I have a question regarding and incident in the F1 Malaysian race.

NBCSN's broadcaster Steve Matchett, of who I have been a fan since he first started back in 1999 said last Sunday that when Sebastian Vettel took his steering wheel from his car, leaving it (sans steering wheel) on the track after the collision with Stroll - that this was a violation of FIA RULES, and I as a long time F1 fan agreed.

Is it a violation of FIA rules?

When, if it is, can we expect to hear of Vettel's penalty?

Thank you folks for your help with these clarifications.

Sincerely.
F1nut

received Friday, Oct. 6th, 2014 7:21am

Dear F1nut: the steering wheel rule is in place to insure the marshals can maneuver a car left out on the circuit. However, in this case, the race was ended and since the steering wheel was clearly not going to be needed by the marshals (the car was not steerable after the crash), it was felt that common sense should prevail and hence no report was made to the stewards. Given its value, Vettel (sensibly) felt the steering wheel should not be left for easy lifting by vandals or souvenir hunters.

I trust this answers your question.

With best wishes,

Nicholas W. Craw, President & CEO

ACCUS, FIA Inc.




What I find most interesting is the lack of an answer to the question "Is it a violation of FIA rules?"

It has been for decades, but apparently only when the FIA deems it is it a violation now.

IMHO, the FIA in general is a different animal today than it has been in the past under Ecclestone - for while there have been questionable things regarding teams and drivers in the past; seems there is an appearance here of the masters of F1 not wanting to do anything that might upset the F1 applecart Championship-wise lest it hurt their TV ratings.

I have read what has been posted - the squabbling over rule 22.5 and am not interested in going thru that issue again - I have contacted Matchett and I expect to hear a discussion of this from him and Hobbs this weekend on the subject, but will simply point out that the race always ends and the top 3 podium guys always drive up to the 1st, 2nd & 3rd place stanchions - they all 3 remove the steering wheel - get out of their cars - and immediately place their steering wheels BACK on the cars.

If it weren't a rule they are used too complying with - why not just toss into the car?

So apparently a "rule is rule" only if the driver involved is not a F1 Championship contender and while Stroll was well within his right to collect rubber, as most of the competitors do after the checkers fall, which was what he was doing by driving across the apex of the corner - (to get to the off apex rubber on the other side of the track) - he should have had the right to do that unmolested and Vettel should have expected it and adjusted his speed accordingly.

The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA and "NOT" I believe from Mr Craw directly, but someone delegated by him to respond and I was disappointed that the FIA can't even answer a simple yes or no question - feel free to do with this information what ya like......

Edited by Mod Aqua to remove contact information of individual


Last edited by F1nut on Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:56 pm 
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I'd guess that drivers are in the habit of replacing the steering wheel, seeing as it's a requirement, which is why one probably sees this in the podium parking spots. From what I gather, Vettel was unable to locate his wheel into the steering column but, interestingly, the response to your query makes no mention of this. It does state that the race had ended, though, which may imply that any driver stopping out on circuit on the post-race lap could just walk off with the steering wheel without concern.
My own take is: yes, strictly speaking, what Vettel did was (most likely) a violation but I would not issue a sanction for it under the circumstances.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:57 pm 
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Well ruled :thumbup:
It was as I thought, the race had ended so the rule didn't need to be enforced regardless of what some dude I've never heard of says.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:03 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:17 pm 
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Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


Last edited by Prema on Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:18 pm 
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F1nut wrote:


The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA and I was disappointed that the FIA can't even answer a simple yes or no question - feel free to do with this information what ya like......


Yes, that answer has all the hallmarks of a PR statement and does not even begin to address your question.

I've watched F1 for 30 some odd years and have never seen a driver walk away with the steering wheel. Any driver who did not replace the wheel incurred a penalty. Further, the drivers at the end of the races ALWAYS have replaced the wheel.

Attaching the wheel pretty much insures that no one will steel it. Is track security that bad that someone can get unfettered access to the car, remove the wheel, and then get away?

An absolutely ridiculous answer, one that the FIA should be embarrassed about.

I agree with you completely, the FIA does not want enforcement of the rules to have any affect at all on the outcome of the championship battle.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:20 pm 
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Makes sense. Some tracks release fans on the track post race. Cameras stop rolling around the track and any staff on the track can just nick the steering wheel without anyone noticing before car was recovered.

Had this happened under racing conditions of during active session, it was sure shot penalty.

Drivers reattach their steering post race in pit because it is under secured conditions and cars may need to be weighed by FIA. But once car is damaged, that goes out of window as well.

It would have been stupid to penalise Vettel for that.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:24 pm 
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Herb Tarlik wrote:
I've watched F1 for 30 some odd years and have never seen a driver walk away with the steering wheel. Any driver who did not replace the wheel incurred a penalty. Further, the drivers at the end of the races ALWAYS have replaced the wheel.


And how many of those were the situations of the car crashing on the track after the race ended?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:37 pm 
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First: The FIA was never under Bernie, that was FOM.

Second: The drivers are operating functional cars when they pull up to the 1st-3rd signs or their pit box.

Third: When you watch the video after the incident you see Vettel try a couple of times to re-fit the wheel then sets it down inside the cockpit of his own car before going back to get it and taking it with him. Why it was hard to put the wheel back in place is anyone's guess but he did visibly struggle with it.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:43 pm 
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F1nut wrote:
I have contacted Matchett and I expect to hear a discussion of this from him and Hobbs this weekend on the subject,


Since you are already at it, could you ask him the question from the dude who-couldn't-care-less-about-him? In his opinion, was Vettel in obvious violation of this rule too? Same section as that other one. And if not, why not?

22.11 If a driver has serious mechanical difficulties he must leave the track as soon as it is safe to do
so.


And also this one:
22.4 If a car stops on the track it shall be the duty of the marshals to remove it as quickly as possible
so that its presence does not constitute a danger or hinder other competitors
.

Were the marshals failing to do their job as per as the letter of the rule? Not following the above safety rule would be a serious matter, compromising the safety and even very lives of the drivers there out..


Last edited by Prema on Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:44 pm 
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Prema wrote:
Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


I looked him up immediately, before posting the information above sir and yes I had a recollection of the name and after reading the same information as in your link above, actually recalled seeing him as a driver at IMSA races, his beemer, as well as his 2 Championships and wins upon his retirement.

I was NOT referring to him as the PR clown and I should have worded it differently above and have corrected my post above to reflect this, I was referring to person delegated to send this response in his name.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:49 pm 
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The FIA are citing Jean Luc Picard:



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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:00 pm 
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F1nut wrote:
Prema wrote:
Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


I looked him up immediately, before posting the information above sir and yes I had a recollection of the name and after reading the same information as in your link above, actually recalled seeing him as a driver at IMSA races, his beemer, as well as his 2 Championships and wins upon his retirement.

I was NOT referring to him as the PR clown and I should have worded it differently above and have corrected my post above to reflect this, I was referring to person delegated to send this response in his name.


I see, you assumed it was someone else... some "PR clown"..
He/she was a nice person to you, as I can see. Doing his/her job in good manner.
And was the answer up to what you wanted to hear, would he/she still be a clown?

Btw., I found your second question,
Quote:
When, if it is, can we expect to hear of Vettel's penalty?


... to be one of the reasons why these people avoid to give clear "yes" or "no" answers on the "yes or no" questions. With this above question you'd put that person into the corner with. It is a "gotcha" question. You know well that there is not going to be any penalty issued, don't you?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:12 pm 
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Well I guess common sense prevailed... Is that a first for F1?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:24 pm 
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I think you should be grateful somebody too time out of their day to give you a detailed and thought out answer.

Nobody seriously wants Vettel to get a penalty for something that has no effect on racing surely?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:48 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
I think you should be grateful somebody too time out of their day to give you a detailed and thought out answer.

Nobody seriously wants Vettel to get a penalty for something that has no effect on racing surely?


Detailed? Thought out??

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:54 pm 
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[quote="mikeyg123"]I think you should be grateful somebody too time out of their day to give you a detailed and thought out answer.

Nobody seriously wants Vettel to get a penalty for something that has no effect on racing surely?[/quote]
I think you might possibly be wrong, there...


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:30 pm 
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Certain people might, although if a penalty like that were to end up affecting the final say, I dread to think what the arguing would devolve to ._.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:47 pm 
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I was expecting ''Dude, it's Vettel and Ferrari, you don't fully expect us to punish that?'' Guess I was wrong.

Common sense while I'm happy to see it in this day and age still being used, a rule is a rule.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:18 pm 
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Prema wrote:

I see, you assumed it was someone else... some "PR clown"..
He/she was a nice person to you, as I can see. Doing his/her job in good manner.
And was the answer up to what you wanted to hear, would he/she still be a clown?

Btw., I found your second question,
Quote:
When, if it is, can we expect to hear of Vettel's penalty?


... to be one of the reasons why these people avoid to give clear "yes" or "no" answers on the "yes or no" questions. With this above question you'd put that person into the corner with. It is a "gotcha" question. You know well that there is not going to be any penalty issued, don't you?


First off, my email was, as I noted above sent Monday morning, Oct. 2nd the day after the race, little was known at that time and general consensus then was that Stroll made an error not Vettel so your comments somewhat fail to account for the timing......

Secondly there was NO answer given here and given that the respnse I got was pretty much verbatim what I'd already read, in several places, it appears I was told the same as everyone in the F1 community. Seemed a safe assumption to me that someone in PR handled the response.

What perhaps you fail to realize here is that I'm a Ferrari fan, so both Vettel and Kimi are drivers I like, but that doesn't bias my opinion enough to not admit they "screwed the pooch" when in fact they did, (unlike others that will make all manner of excuses for their team and drivers). When I'm wrong I try to admit it.

I'm pulling for Vettel to win the championship, always pull for Kimi and for Ferrari to once again reclaim the Constructors Title so having them penalized is not something I want to see, but not if they get preferential treatment simply because their driver is setting #2 in the running for World Champion. That situation is no way fair to the other teams nor is it fair to the other drivers.

In fact it's exactly like the Chinese GP where Daniel Ricciardo and Sergio Perez were given penalties for not turning up "on-time" for the pre-race anthem national anthem, but Esteban Ocon's absence was not looked into - how was that fair?

tootsie323 wrote:
From what I gather, Vettel was unable to locate his wheel into the steering column but, interestingly, the response to your query makes no mention of this.


I have read that too, (believe another mentioned it here) and seems somewhere I read that Vettel said that to a reporter - that is not what I saw on the day. I saw him place the steering wheel back on the steering rack upon exiting his car and when he ran back, before catching a ride with Pascal, it appeared he took it off the steering rack - this has been reported at GMS and another place I cannot recall. There does appear to be some question as to whom saw what, (besides the fact that I was unaware of any damage other than the left quarter, which begs the question how does damage at the rear affect attachment of the steering wheel :? ).

I was seeking a clarification of rule 22.5 for my own F1 education, getting the F1 party line response tells me as a fan nothing I had not already read and only confuses things, especially the "hence no report was made to the stewards" part - which sounds an awful lot like the left hand has no clue what the right hand is doing........

Good for me as a Ferrari fan - but if god smiles on the prancing horse and Vettel wins the WDC - we will never hear the end of it.


Last edited by F1nut on Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:23 pm 
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So all your upset-ness is based on that they didn't penalise him just because it was Vettel? What evidence is there to support this enough for you to email angry letters to the FIA?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:01 pm 
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Warheart01 wrote:
I was expecting ''Dude, it's Vettel and Ferrari, you don't fully expect us to punish that?'' Guess I was wrong.

Common sense while I'm happy to see it in this day and age still being used, a rule is a rule.


It's nonsense to apply a rule nonsensically.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:23 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
So all your upset-ness is based on that they didn't penalise him just because it was Vettel? What evidence is there to support this enough for you to email angry letters to the FIA?


you've got the cart before the horse here.... :lol:

What part of "sent Monday morning, Oct. 2nd the day after the race, little was known at that time" are you not comprehending?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:24 pm 
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Prema wrote:
Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


Track security after the Checker Flag and while the race is taking place are two different things. Nick Craw is not a PR hack and has a CV that would shame the OP!

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:58 pm 
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mmi16 wrote:
Prema wrote:
Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


Track security after the Checker Flag and while the race is taking place are two different things. Nick Craw is not a PR hack and has a CV that would shame the OP!

:thumbup:
It seems like a perfectly sensible, personal and courteous reply. Moreover there was no real necessity to take the time to answer an email from an individual not directly involved at all.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:12 pm 
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F1nut wrote:
Covalent wrote:
So all your upset-ness is based on that they didn't penalise him just because it was Vettel? What evidence is there to support this enough for you to email angry letters to the FIA?


you've got the cart before the horse here.... :lol:

What part of "sent Monday morning, Oct. 2nd the day after the race, little was known at that time" are you not comprehending?

Don't know how timing affects what I wrote at all... Have they since clarified the situation regarding your perceived favouritism?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:27 pm 
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mmi16 wrote:
Prema wrote:
Quote:
The answer I received above was from some PR clown for the FIA

You received a prompt answer, have been treated with respect. Just because the reply happened to be not up to your likening or fitting to a narrative you'd like to, you go calling names.
At least take few seconds and learn about the person whom you call a clown.
https://www.fia.com/profile/officers/nicholas-w-craw


Track security after the Checker Flag and while the race is taking place are two different things. Nick Craw is not a PR hack and has a CV that would shame the OP!

Eh. Only one of Craw's Ivy League degrees was cum laude. Doesn't impress me much. ;)

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:15 pm 
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Well, it was good of you to send your question to the FIA, and I have to say you got a far clearer answer back, than I got when I wrote to the EU concerning subliminal advertising.

The statement that no report was sent to the stewards interests me, and I believe this to be true. Like you, I would liked to have heard about the applicability of the rule after the race, but I cannot fault them for exercising common sense.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:58 pm 
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To be honest I'm more surprised he didn't get in trouble for catching a lift.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 5:09 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Warheart01 wrote:
I was expecting ''Dude, it's Vettel and Ferrari, you don't fully expect us to punish that?'' Guess I was wrong.

Common sense while I'm happy to see it in this day and age still being used, a rule is a rule.


It's nonsense to apply a rule nonsensically.


A rule is a rule. If a rule isn't followed it's not a rule but ''more like actual guidelines'', now where have I heard that before?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 6:45 am 
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F1nut wrote:
First off, my email was, as I noted above sent Monday morning, Oct. 2nd the day after the race, little was known at that time and general consensus then was that Stroll made an error not Vettel so your comments somewhat fail to account for the timing......


By Monday it was pretty much obvious that there was nothing there being investigated and no penalties anticipated, and it already became a kind of a controversy. Guess, that was why you wrote the letter already then without waiting another day or two. It is not your regular practice to write such kind of letters to the FIA on Mondays after race, is it?

And anyway, your question was not even providing a space for eventual penalties in the case of the rule be confirmed to be broken, but plainly demanding "when". It was the letter of an apparently agitated fan (that the person answering to you must have failed to realize was the fan of Ferrari and someone supporting Vettel for wining the WDC).

Quote:
Secondly there was NO answer given here and given that the respnse I got was pretty much verbatim what I'd already read, in several places, it appears I was told the same as everyone in the F1 community. Seemed a safe assumption to me that someone in PR handled the response.


It is a pretty much a "no" answer to your question, but short of being spelled out. You were explained as what the purpose/context of the rule was, and that after the race was over such purpose/context was lost and rather the concerns for other kind of safety (protecting the steering wheel itself from falling into unwarranted hands), hence the common sense to its application is to be exercised. That is a big "NO" to me.
Sometimes there can even be some "gray" areas in interpreting/applying some rules, but you don't seam to be open to it with your fixed "100% or 0%" position.

Maybe that person was sensitive and did not want to upset your feelings since you stated in the letter that you were the fan of Steve Matcchet and he stated on TV that Vettel clearly broke the said rule?

Quote:
What perhaps you fail to realize here is that I'm a Ferrari fan, so both Vettel and Kimi are drivers I like, but that doesn't bias my opinion enough to not admit they "screwed the pooch" when in fact they did, (unlike others that will make all manner of excuses for their team and drivers). When I'm wrong I try to admit it.


I can't possibly be failing to realize something that is not up to my knowledge to start with. You may say that I don't know this or that about you, yes.
But speaking of bias and realization, I do realize where your bias is being generated: Steve Matcchet. So much so that you have personally invested yourself in this, otherwise to me pretty much a non-issue.

Quote:
I'm pulling for Vettel to win the championship, always pull for Kimi and for Ferrari to once again reclaim the Constructors Title so having them penalized is not something I want to see, but not if they get preferential treatment simply because their driver is setting #2 in the running for World Champion. That situation is no way fair to the other teams nor is it fair to the other drivers.


You'd need to point to a similar case where the car was damaged badly on the slow-down lap and the driver took the steering wheel with himself and then was penalized.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:21 am 
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Warheart01 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Warheart01 wrote:
I was expecting ''Dude, it's Vettel and Ferrari, you don't fully expect us to punish that?'' Guess I was wrong.

Common sense while I'm happy to see it in this day and age still being used, a rule is a rule.


It's nonsense to apply a rule nonsensically.


A rule is a rule. If a rule isn't followed it's not a rule but ''more like actual guidelines'', now where have I heard that before?


:thumbup:

30.7 (I think?) A driver who abandons his car must leave it in neutral or with the clutch disengaged and with
the steering wheel in place. Qua?


Last edited by LBET on Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:28 am 
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I never thought anyone from the FIA would respond to a fan query. All those wasted opportunities...

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:57 am 
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Warheart01 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Warheart01 wrote:
I was expecting ''Dude, it's Vettel and Ferrari, you don't fully expect us to punish that?'' Guess I was wrong.

Common sense while I'm happy to see it in this day and age still being used, a rule is a rule.


It's nonsense to apply a rule nonsensically.


A rule is a rule. If a rule isn't followed it's not a rule but ''more like actual guidelines'', now where have I heard that before?

Not really. There is always provision for judgment calls. What if a driver has an accident during the race, his car catches fire and he has to sprint away as soon as he gets out? Do you think he'll be penalised for not spending precious seconds trying to reaffix the steering wheel? There's no provision for that in the rules either but clearly they aren't going to be doing anything to the driver then. Safety trumps process any day of the week.

From the video footage it's abundantly clear that Vettel was struggling to re-attach the steering wheel, as he made a number of attempts even before his taxi arrived. I even commented on it in the race thread at the time, so this isn't even hindsight talking. it certainly looks as if he originally sets it down in the footwell, before changing his mind and retrieving it. If the wheel can't be put back anyway, what purpose is there in having him leave it on the seat?

I'm having to wonder at the motivation of those who are so desperate for penalties even with something that has obviously no bearing on the race itself.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:58 am 
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"It was felt that common sense should prevail."

And it did.

Rules are strange things and they are sometimes detrimental. We can be clever enough to use common sense.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:00 am 
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F1nut wrote:
Prema wrote:

I see, you assumed it was someone else... some "PR clown"..
He/she was a nice person to you, as I can see. Doing his/her job in good manner.
And was the answer up to what you wanted to hear, would he/she still be a clown?

Btw., I found your second question,
Quote:
When, if it is, can we expect to hear of Vettel's penalty?


... to be one of the reasons why these people avoid to give clear "yes" or "no" answers on the "yes or no" questions. With this above question you'd put that person into the corner with. It is a "gotcha" question. You know well that there is not going to be any penalty issued, don't you?


First off, my email was, as I noted above sent Monday morning, Oct. 2nd the day after the race, little was known at that time and general consensus then was that Stroll made an error not Vettel so your comments somewhat fail to account for the timing......

Secondly there was NO answer given here and given that the respnse I got was pretty much verbatim what I'd already read, in several places, it appears I was told the same as everyone in the F1 community. Seemed a safe assumption to me that someone in PR handled the response.

What perhaps you fail to realize here is that I'm a Ferrari fan, so both Vettel and Kimi are drivers I like, but that doesn't bias my opinion enough to not admit they "screwed the pooch" when in fact they did, (unlike others that will make all manner of excuses for their team and drivers). When I'm wrong I try to admit it.

I'm pulling for Vettel to win the championship, always pull for Kimi and for Ferrari to once again reclaim the Constructors Title so having them penalized is not something I want to see, but not if they get preferential treatment simply because their driver is setting #2 in the running for World Champion. That situation is no way fair to the other teams nor is it fair to the other drivers.

In fact it's exactly like the Chinese GP where Daniel Ricciardo and Sergio Perez were given penalties for not turning up "on-time" for the pre-race anthem national anthem, but Esteban Ocon's absence was not looked into - how was that fair?

tootsie323 wrote:
From what I gather, Vettel was unable to locate his wheel into the steering column but, interestingly, the response to your query makes no mention of this.


I have read that too, (believe another mentioned it here) and seems somewhere I read that Vettel said that to a reporter - that is not what I saw on the day. I saw him place the steering wheel back on the steering rack upon exiting his car and when he ran back, before catching a ride with Pascal, it appeared he took it off the steering rack - this has been reported at GMS and another place I cannot recall. There does appear to be some question as to whom saw what, (besides the fact that I was unaware of any damage other than the left quarter, which begs the question how does damage at the rear affect attachment of the steering wheel :? ).

I was seeking a clarification of rule 22.5 for my own F1 education, getting the F1 party line response tells me as a fan nothing I had not already read and only confuses things, especially the "hence no report was made to the stewards" part - which sounds an awful lot like the left hand has no clue what the right hand is doing........

Good for me as a Ferrari fan - but if god smiles on the prancing horse and Vettel wins the WDC - we will never hear the end of it.

What you wrote about placing it on the steering rack is simply not true. It may be your interpretation of events but I saw Vettel struggling to replace it and eventually putting it down in the footwell. I commented on it at the time in the race thread as a potential reason why he took it with him, as he was clearly struggling with something in the cockpit.

There is no reason to assume preferential treatment for this


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:26 am 
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Even if some people want to refuse to exercise any common sense and just stick blindly to "the rule is the rule is the rule", it won't hold the water. The section "General Safety" stipulates the relevant situations that those rules within that sections are meant for:

22.2 pit lane and track discipline and
safety measures will be the same for all practice sessions as for the race


And in the reply in this FIA letter, it states clearly:
However, in this case, the race was ended

In the legal sense of the said rule being broken or not and consequentially issuing or not issuing any penalties, this above would be the arguing point. And in the case of a common sense being already rejected, one would have to search the Sporting Regulations that would define the race not ending with the "cool-down" lap after cars passed the checkered flag.
Good luck.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:42 am 
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]So RoGro demolished his car on track in Japan, leaving it in an undrivable condition. A crane would be needed to lift it onto a flat bed for removal from the track, yet hestill replaced the steering wheel.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:50 am 
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Herb Tarlik wrote:
So RoGro demolished his car on track in Japan, leaving it in an undrivable condition. A crane would be needed to lift it onto a flat bed for removal from the track, yet hestill replaced the steering wheel.
He did indeed. During a qualifying session. And because he could.

Oh, and strictly speaking, he didn't demolish his car on track. The track ends at the outside of the white lines. [/pedant mode] ;)

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 10:00 am 
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Look, I'm not the greatest Vettel fan here - I've even put my 2 cents into the collision being mainly Seb's fault (based on the video from Stroll's car) - but after the race has finished, when the car has to be craned (and can be safely without concern about racing vehicles) - honestly, I have to vote with 'it's a non issue'.


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