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Obama rate his presidency.
A 12%  12%  [ 3 ]
B 48%  48%  [ 12 ]
C 20%  20%  [ 5 ]
D 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
F 16%  16%  [ 4 ]
Total votes : 25
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 5:37 pm 
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Its Obama's second term and knowing this is somewhat an international website I want to know how you guys rate Obama as a president. Personally he has been a big letdown I would rate him at most a C-.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:41 pm 
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I don't pretend to understand the US system but it all seems to be going flat for Obama. With such huge debts and such danger around the world, how can there every be any positivity in modern politics.

I think we are all a long way from stability, never mind positive growth and peace, unfortunately.

I hope I am wrong.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:59 pm 
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Domestic policy doesn't much bother me. Their foreign policy is like drawing smiley faces on a bullet and thinking that will make your soldiers seem friendly. That said, I'm not actually against American foreign policy, I just don't think much has changed.

I do believe health care should be freely accessible to all. I won't say if it's right or wrong for the USA as that isn't my place.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 10:55 am 
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I was going to write a load of stuff about not knowing enough to grade him and how the US political system seems even more broken than ours - but instead I'll just ask if I can vote for Abe Lincoln instead? ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX_1B0w7Hzc

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 5:49 pm 
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So far Obama has done rather well on the international front. As far as I'm aware, he hasn't started any illegal wars, so that puts him miles ahead of his predecessor.
But US politics are mainly fought within the national boundaries (aren't they all?) and I'm not qualified to judge that. The one comment I would dare to make is that the US seem bent on electing a government leader, and then handicap him/her with a parliament that thinks its highest goal must be to impeach him, or failing that, restrict him/her to the maximum extent. Perhaps the outdated political system invites such practices, but it is rather funny to watch. Funny, but funny of the worrying kind. Somebody should invite the US to enter the 21st century, I think.

What kept Obama from closing Guantanamo Bay?

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 9:00 pm 
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C

To put it in context, I'd probbably rate Bush as an E- and Clinton as a B+.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:18 pm 
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B for me, but I'm not American and I'm not living there.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:57 pm 
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I give him "B" since "A" would mean "excellent" and that certainly has not been the case.

In the first hand, I greatly respect his fight to push through The Affordable Care Act, something that has been an agenda in decades and several presidents/governments have talked about it and even attempted it in some levels. But they all gave up as it was demanding too much effort and engagement, and politically it was not very much a promising act in terms of some returns like popularity even. The opposition that was mounded against him was incredible, the propaganda to depict the president as a Nazi/Communistic dictator was ridiculous to watch from this side. Europe has already had much more developed and just fine functioning "Obamacare" in place for decades, and we don't consider our leaders "Nazis" for upholding it. It is unbelievable how much of a crazy propaganda is sometimes being seen disseminated to the folk there.

On the international scene he did quite OK by trying not to involve the US in any new wars. But again, it must be so hard to do anything since he will be hummered over his head for doing it as just much as for not doing it. My disappointment here is in him eventually falling into that same old "Bush" rhetoric of taking the war against terrorism to wherever it takes to whomever it takes for as long as it takes.

And of course, the big disappointment with him taking that line of NSA secret massive global surveillance on not only the home population. Not closing the Gitmo would be an another disappointment particularly so since it was given a promise given at the time of the presidential elections. In general, the election's slogan "Yes we can" turned out to be quite just that.. an election's slogan. But then, seeing that amount of a diversion, opposition and even sabotage that he has been facing in whatever he already attempted to accomplish, I am not even so surprised.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 3:49 pm 
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What is interesting here is that most people who have commented aren't American! Someone said it earlier, he seems more liked outside the US than inside. I've also noticed how a lot of people are saying they like him partly for wanting to get affordable health care for his people in place. But the only Americans I've actually spoken to about this were the stereotypical republican supporters who hated Obama and their main reason was because of Obama Care. Their actual argument for this was 'it has made it worse for everyone, well it's helped the poor out but nobody else'! I don't know if they're in the minority thinking this, or the republican propaganda is working on them, but surely helping out the people who can't afford health care is the whole purpose of what he was trying to do and this would obviously have a knock on effect of increased taxes or higher health care costs for the people who could afford it? I do find it interesting that this os an issue that Europeans agree with on but Americans seem to not.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 4:17 pm 
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minchy wrote:
What is interesting here is that most people who have commented aren't American! Someone said it earlier, he seems more liked outside the US than inside. I've also noticed how a lot of people are saying they like him partly for wanting to get affordable health care for his people in place. But the only Americans I've actually spoken to about this were the stereotypical republican supporters who hated Obama and their main reason was because of Obama Care. Their actual argument for this was 'it has made it worse for everyone, well it's helped the poor out but nobody else'! I don't know if they're in the minority thinking this, or the republican propaganda is working on them, but surely helping out the people who can't afford health care is the whole purpose of what he was trying to do and this would obviously have a knock on effect of increased taxes or higher health care costs for the people who could afford it? I do find it interesting that this os an issue that Europeans agree with on but Americans seem to not.

To be honest, I think Obamacare is pretty fairy cakes. Either commit to universal healthcare like any civilised country would or don't. A half-assed middle ground is an awful solution and shows that he was scared of the reaction he'd get from the tea-bag right (which he got anyway).

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 5:48 pm 
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TheOtherGuy wrote:
minchy wrote:
What is interesting here is that most people who have commented aren't American! Someone said it earlier, he seems more liked outside the US than inside. I've also noticed how a lot of people are saying they like him partly for wanting to get affordable health care for his people in place. But the only Americans I've actually spoken to about this were the stereotypical republican supporters who hated Obama and their main reason was because of Obama Care. Their actual argument for this was 'it has made it worse for everyone, well it's helped the poor out but nobody else'! I don't know if they're in the minority thinking this, or the republican propaganda is working on them, but surely helping out the people who can't afford health care is the whole purpose of what he was trying to do and this would obviously have a knock on effect of increased taxes or higher health care costs for the people who could afford it? I do find it interesting that this os an issue that Europeans agree with on but Americans seem to not.

To be honest, I think Obamacare is pretty fairy cakes. Either commit to universal healthcare like any civilised country would or don't. A half-assed middle ground is an awful solution and shows that he was scared of the reaction he'd get from the tea-bag right (which he got anyway).


And yet, he is the only president in the history of the US who has managed even so far with that what you call pretty "fairy cakes". It shows something about him? Or other presidents of the US? Or the US?

Just out of curiosity, I checked some facts and it states that:

"Over 15 million folks who didn’t have health insurance before the ACA was signed into law in 2010 are now covered bringing the total uninsured adults in the US from 18% to 13.4%."
http://obamacarefacts.com/sign-ups/obam ... t-numbers/

It looks to me that 15 million people who didn't have health insurance are now having it, that it is not so awful situation as compared to before.

Personally, I have no idea how Obama would possibly be able to push through a complete universal health care system like seen here in Europe. He would be shot dead before it happens. There is simply far too much of money being involved there, it is a huge business (reportedly, it would become the fifth largest economy in the world if to split off). It is the capital that rich, powerful corporations and private organizations/individuals won't let loose the control over it just like that. Indeed, I would be surprised if Obamacare makes it much longer after he's gone.


And I find these statements to be telling about the situation of the health system in the US:

"Half of all healthcare spending goes towards 5 percent of the population."

"On average, these are people who use $40,000 of health care annually."

"The lower-spending half of the population, meanwhile, spent a paltry $236 per person during that same year."

http://www.vox.com/2014/9/2/6089693/hea ... -insurance


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:11 pm 
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Prema wrote:
TheOtherGuy wrote:
minchy wrote:
What is interesting here is that most people who have commented aren't American! Someone said it earlier, he seems more liked outside the US than inside. I've also noticed how a lot of people are saying they like him partly for wanting to get affordable health care for his people in place. But the only Americans I've actually spoken to about this were the stereotypical republican supporters who hated Obama and their main reason was because of Obama Care. Their actual argument for this was 'it has made it worse for everyone, well it's helped the poor out but nobody else'! I don't know if they're in the minority thinking this, or the republican propaganda is working on them, but surely helping out the people who can't afford health care is the whole purpose of what he was trying to do and this would obviously have a knock on effect of increased taxes or higher health care costs for the people who could afford it? I do find it interesting that this os an issue that Europeans agree with on but Americans seem to not.

To be honest, I think Obamacare is pretty fairy cakes. Either commit to universal healthcare like any civilised country would or don't. A half-assed middle ground is an awful solution and shows that he was scared of the reaction he'd get from the tea-bag right (which he got anyway).


And yet, he is the only president in the history of the US who has managed even so far with that what you call pretty "fairy cakes". It shows something about him? Or other presidents of the US? Or the US?

Just out of curiosity, I checked some facts and it states that:

"Over 15 million folks who didn’t have health insurance before the ACA was signed into law in 2010 are now covered bringing the total uninsured adults in the US from 18% to 13.4%."
http://obamacarefacts.com/sign-ups/obam ... t-numbers/

It looks to me that 15 million people who didn't have health insurance are now having it, that it is not so awful situation as compared to before.

Personally, I have no idea how Obama would possibly be able to push through a complete universal health care system like seen here in Europe. He would be shot dead before it happens. There is simply far too much of money being involved there, it is a huge business (reportedly, it would become the fifth largest economy in the world if to split off). It is the capital that rich, powerful corporations and private organizations/individuals won't let loose the control over it just like that. Indeed, I would be surprised if Obamacare makes it much longer after he's gone.


And I find these statements to be telling about the situation of the health system in the US:

"Half of all healthcare spending goes towards 5 percent of the population."

"On average, these are people who use $40,000 of health care annually."

"The lower-spending half of the population, meanwhile, spent a paltry $236 per person during that same year."

http://www.vox.com/2014/9/2/6089693/hea ... -insurance

Basically, Obamacare has made a healthcare system that was horrifically bad slightly better. It's still a tragically bad system that needs huge reforms so forgive me for not being too enthusiastic about it.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 6:54 pm 
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TheOtherGuy wrote:
Basically, Obamacare has made a healthcare system that was horrifically bad slightly better. It's still a tragically bad system that needs huge reforms so forgive me for not being too enthusiastic about it.


I wouldn't be too enthusiastic about it either. But he made a step in to the right direction, with a huge struggle and putting himself on the line. And for that, I give him the credit. He tried, and he did something, didn't he? Which one of his predecessors did more or better than him in that regard?

And let's see where the next president coming after him will take it to.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 8:50 pm 
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The problem with the ACA (Affordable Care Act) is that it really isn't health care reform, it's instead health insurance reform. Not to say that health insurance reform wasn't important, because it was, however that of itself isn't enough to correct the base system of medical treatment delivery and can only be effective once that is addressed as well. Of course unless the Republicans manage to severly shoot themselves in the foot over the next 2 years (even odds on that) they could well end up with the White House too after the next election and the remainder of the work will never be done.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 9:17 pm 
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I'll give him a 10 just because of this:
(Watch the vid ;) )

http://news.sky.com/story/1358053/man-tells-obama-dont-touch-my-girlfriend

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 20, 2014 8:57 pm 
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Given the scope of what the Presidents actual powers are, versus what people seem to expect of the office, I gave him a firm B, maybe even B+. Others have covered some of the arguments pretty well. He has generally tried to do what he said he would.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 4:01 am 
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If you take out all the unrealistic expectations of him being the next messiah who was going to lead the US to a whole new era of world domination, I don't think he has done too bad at all. I would rate him lower than Clinton, but higher than G.W Bush.

He hasn't had an easy time of it, especially with the Tea baggers and FOX News who are still furious that a black man is in the white house, and refer to him as the worst president in recent history (they have very short memories). His somewhat aloof nature and "I know best" attitude hasn't helped.

All in all I do think people will be disappointed as the expectations were high.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 3:42 pm 
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Juans Girl wrote:
If you take out all the unrealistic expectations of him being the next messiah who was going to lead the US to a whole new era of world domination, I don't think he has done too bad at all. I would rate him lower than Clinton, but higher than G.W Bush.

He hasn't had an easy time of it, especially with the Tea baggers and FOX News who are still furious that a black man is in the white house, and refer to him as the worst president in recent history (they have very short memories). His somewhat aloof nature and "I know best" attitude hasn't helped.

All in all I do think people will be disappointed as the expectations were high.


Please include proof if you're going to make such blanket statements as: "especially with the Tea baggers and FOX News who are still furious that a black man is in the white house". If you don't, which you can't, it simply shows massive ignorance on your part & just another contribution to the race-baiting club we've all had to endure during the Obama failure.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 6:42 pm 
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rotbimmer wrote:
during the Obama failure.

Speaking of baiting...


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 2:10 am 
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DaveStebbins wrote:
rotbimmer wrote:
during the Obama failure.

Speaking of baiting...


You can't handle the truth.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:31 am 
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I'd rate Obama about on par with W. Bush. Both had some incredible challenges during their Presidencies.

All in all though I'd still say W would be better graded. With Obama's latest Presidential Decrees he's trying to circumvent processes he said he never would. His arrogance is pretty telling. Also the total lack of accountability within his regime is stunning. Not one person has ever said I messed up and resigned, not one.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 1:38 pm 
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I am not good enough at politics to judge a USA president. Even if i were, i would have preferred not to judge him/her. Being a good enough politician doesn't make a perfect Emperor, let alone rating a Ruler afterall.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 2:40 pm 
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Personally, I rate Obama's presidency as a solid "B", an "A" up until the last few months. I cannot recall any president who started his Presidency with the leader of the Senate opposition party making a statement that his goal was to make sure that NOTHING Obama pushed got passed. Nor a President who has had to face such a hostile house of representatives to get any legislation passed. There are still some of his judicial appointments open, not being brought to a vote, from his FIRST term. Nor have I ever seen the Supreme Court, an entity that is supposed to be non-partisan, become just another partisan toy. The obstacles that Obama has had to face as president are, in my opinion, greater than any president who has preceded him.

About the Affordable Care Act. Which was actually very similar to the Care program implemented in Massachusetts while Mitt Romney was governor, a program that was modified to take in several of the Republican demands a year before it was finally implemented, is something that, while far from perfect, was long overdue. Sadly, if the Senate and the House would have worked together rather than at odds, some of the flaws might have been recognized and improved on, and saved a lot of the pains and expenses that the program implementation suffered.

Obama took over a disaster when it comes to International Relations, which was a big concern for me personally, and has improved things substantially as I see it... that said, after Bush/Cheney, almost anything would be an improvement.

I would like to address the concern above about Obama "circumventing processes". He has been forced to circumvent the process because he has a disfunctional legislative body with both a House and a Senate that are more concerned about their party and who is greasing their back pockets than they are for the people they were elected to serve. A body that will vote down a good idea if the other party brings it to the table, that will stall anything the other party wants. There is a reason that both the House and the Senate have the lowest ratings in the history of either body. What president has ever had to deal with that... even when the opposition held Both bodies, there used to be at least SOME across the aisle cooperation... but not any more.

On the matter of "accountability", he has not been any less so than his predecessor. After the stonewalling seen by Cheney and Rove, it is funny to even see it mentioned that this presidency has not been accountable.

Lastly, I know it is not politically correct to say so, but I still feel that "race" is an issue with this presidency. I honestly think that a whilte President would not have had as many problems that Obama has had to face. I don't want to get into it further, as that would sidetrack the topic, but it is just a feeling that I have.

Obama has made mistakes, no doubt about it. Obama has been arrogant at times, no question (but then how do you become President without some arrogance), and at times it has been costly. Obama has been defensive at times when perhaps a softer tone would have gotten more support (from the public, not the House). However, this American thinks that Obama has done well given the walls he has had to climb.

And don't even get me started on the "tea party"..................................

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Last edited by Blake on Tue Dec 09, 2014 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 2:43 pm 
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rotbimmer wrote:
DaveStebbins wrote:
rotbimmer wrote:
during the Obama failure.

Speaking of baiting...


You can't handle the truth.


If you believe in the Tea Party and Fox News, you probably wouldn't recognize the truth if seen, so it is a mute point.
;)

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:08 pm 
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It does always make me chuckle when the GOP/Tea Party/Fox (aren't they basically the same organisation anyway?) refer to Obama as being left-wing/a socialist/a fire-breathing commie. In Europe, the furthest left he would be is centre-right....

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:16 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Personally, I rate Obama's presidency as a solid "B", an "A" up until the last few months. I cannot recall any president who started his Presidency with the leader of the Senate opposition party making a statement that his goal was to make sure that NOTHING Obama pushed got passed. Nor a President who has had to face such a hostile house of representatives to get any legislation passed. There are still some of his judicial appointments open, not being brought to a vote, from his FIRST term. Nor have I ever seen the Supreme Court, an entity that is supposed to be non-partisan, become just another partisan toy. The obstacles that Obama has had to face as president are, in my opinion, greater than any president who has preceded him.

About the Affordable Care Act. Which was actually very similar to the Care program implemented in Massachusetts while Mitt Romney was governor, a program that was modified to take in several of the Republican demands a year before it was finally implemented, is something that, while far from perfect, was long overdue. Sadly, if the Senate and the House would have worked together rather than at odds, some of the flaws might have been recognized and improved on, and saved a lot of the pains and expenses that the program implementation suffered.

Obama took over a disaster when it comes to International Relations, which was a big concern for me personally, and has improved things substantially as I see it... that said, after Bush/Cheney, almost anything would be an improvement.

I would like to address the concern above about Obama "circumventing processes". He has been forced to circumvent the process because he has a disfunctional legislative body with both a House and a Senate that are more concerned about their party and who is greasing their back pockets than they are for the people they were elected to serve. A body that will vote down a good idea if the other party brings it to the table, that will stall anything the other party wants. There is a reason that both the House and the Senate have the lowest ratings in the history of either body. What president has ever had to deal with that... even when the opposition held Both bodies, there used to be at least SOME across the aisle cooperation... but not any more.

On the matter of "accountability", he has not been any less so than his predecessor. After the stonewalling seen by Cheney and Rove, it is funny to even see it mentioned that this presidency has not been accountable.

Lastly, I know it is not politically correct to say so, but I still feel that "race" is an issue with this presidency. I honestly think that a whilte President would not have had as many problems that Obama has had to face. I don't want to get into it further, as that would sidetrack the topic, but it is just a feeling that I have.

Obama has made mistakes, no doubt about it. Obama has been arrogant at times, no question (but then how do you become President without some arrogance), and at times it has been costly. Obama has been defensive at times when perhaps a softer tone would have gotten more support (from the public, not the House). However, this American thinks that Obama has done well given the walls he has had to climb.

And don't even get me started on the "tea party"..................................

:thumbup: Thanks Blake. I was waiting for you to post here as I thought of all the US forumites you would probably give a more in depth and partial opinion.

Most of what you said is what I've preserved from the UK media, but is also what seems to be dismissed by die hard republicans so we never know if what we see overseas is accurate or not.

As to your last point, I agree this is not the place to discuss it, but the USA does have the stereotype of still having a race orientated culture which has affected Obama's presidency a lot.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 11:36 am 
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rotbimmer wrote:
Juans Girl wrote:
If you take out all the unrealistic expectations of him being the next messiah who was going to lead the US to a whole new era of world domination, I don't think he has done too bad at all. I would rate him lower than Clinton, but higher than G.W Bush.

He hasn't had an easy time of it, especially with the Tea baggers and FOX News who are still furious that a black man is in the white house, and refer to him as the worst president in recent history (they have very short memories). His somewhat aloof nature and "I know best" attitude hasn't helped.

All in all I do think people will be disappointed as the expectations were high.


Please include proof if you're going to make such blanket statements as: "especially with the Tea baggers and FOX News who are still furious that a black man is in the white house". If you don't, which you can't, it simply shows massive ignorance on your part & just another contribution to the race-baiting club we've all had to endure during the Obama failure.



You're going to seriously tell me that his race is not an issue, especially when you see signs like "Lets bring the white back to the white house" at Tea Bagger rallies ? Tell me how many blacks or Hispanics you see at their rallies . To say that people didn't not vote for him because of his race is quite naïve.

You're also telling me far right bullies like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity have no problem with his race ? The amount of vitriol the far right has shown to Obama is astounding. The ignorance lies with the people who think his race is not an issue.

As for 'give me proof" request, if a Klansman walks down the street in his "uniform" do you need to ask him if he's a bigot ?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:28 pm 
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Obama planning to open the embassy in Havana, being for 1.5 years in a secret talks with Havana, trying to normalize the US relationship with Cuba after 50 years of a hopelessly useless hard line... a big plus to him. Never mind that Congress will probably turn its back to him on that one.
(and now, just waiting for FOX guys to jump for his "communistic" throat..)


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2015 5:20 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Personally, I rate Obama's presidency as a solid "B", an "A" up until the last few months. I cannot recall any president who started his Presidency with the leader of the Senate opposition party making a statement that his goal was to make sure that NOTHING Obama pushed got passed. Nor a President who has had to face such a hostile house of representatives to get any legislation passed. There are still some of his judicial appointments open, not being brought to a vote, from his FIRST term. Nor have I ever seen the Supreme Court, an entity that is supposed to be non-partisan, become just another partisan toy. The obstacles that Obama has had to face as president are, in my opinion, greater than any president who has preceded him.

About the Affordable Care Act. Which was actually very similar to the Care program implemented in Massachusetts while Mitt Romney was governor, a program that was modified to take in several of the Republican demands a year before it was finally implemented, is something that, while far from perfect, was long overdue. Sadly, if the Senate and the House would have worked together rather than at odds, some of the flaws might have been recognized and improved on, and saved a lot of the pains and expenses that the program implementation suffered.

Obama took over a disaster when it comes to International Relations, which was a big concern for me personally, and has improved things substantially as I see it... that said, after Bush/Cheney, almost anything would be an improvement.

I would like to address the concern above about Obama "circumventing processes". He has been forced to circumvent the process because he has a disfunctional legislative body with both a House and a Senate that are more concerned about their party and who is greasing their back pockets than they are for the people they were elected to serve. A body that will vote down a good idea if the other party brings it to the table, that will stall anything the other party wants. There is a reason that both the House and the Senate have the lowest ratings in the history of either body. What president has ever had to deal with that... even when the opposition held Both bodies, there used to be at least SOME across the aisle cooperation... but not any more.

On the matter of "accountability", he has not been any less so than his predecessor. After the stonewalling seen by Cheney and Rove, it is funny to even see it mentioned that this presidency has not been accountable.

Lastly, I know it is not politically correct to say so, but I still feel that "race" is an issue with this presidency. I honestly think that a whilte President would not have had as many problems that Obama has had to face. I don't want to get into it further, as that would sidetrack the topic, but it is just a feeling that I have.

Obama has made mistakes, no doubt about it. Obama has been arrogant at times, no question (but then how do you become President without some arrogance), and at times it has been costly. Obama has been defensive at times when perhaps a softer tone would have gotten more support (from the public, not the House). However, this American thinks that Obama has done well given the walls he has had to climb.

And don't even get me started on the "tea party"..................................


Yes, Blake, let's get started on the TEA party. Most people have no clue who or what the TEA party stands for and it sounds like you don't either.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2015 5:21 pm 
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What a total joke our president is. He is Santa Claus and our public is too stupid to figure it out.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2015 6:19 pm 
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Steve C wrote:
What a total joke our president is. He is Santa Claus and our public is too stupid to figure it out.

For the benefit of those of us who aren't American and don't know all the info about Obama's administration other than some of his international speeches and a bit of foreign policy, can you elaborate as to why you think that?

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:33 am 
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minchy wrote:
Steve C wrote:
What a total joke our president is. He is Santa Claus and our public is too stupid to figure it out.

For the benefit of those of us who aren't American and don't know all the info about Obama's administration other than some of his international speeches and a bit of foreign policy, can you elaborate as to why you think that?


I'll sure try...

What he's said he was going to do hasn't happened except for changing America so that we're all the same. The wars haven't stopped. GITMO hasn't been closed yet. People are not back to work and in fact more people are out of work than almost ever before.

We have far too many people asking for help than ever before. I cannot afford to pay for them anymore.

He has put of further in debt. This debt is only. Y kids kids head and they haven't been born yet.

I'd love to have this debate with anyone because more often than not I come out of it learning but it is so hard to get a left leaning person to debate without calling me names.

I come to this great we page because of Formula One but I have no problem talking about other subjects.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 3:40 am 
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Steve C wrote:
minchy wrote:
Steve C wrote:
What a total joke our president is. He is Santa Claus and our public is too stupid to figure it out.

For the benefit of those of us who aren't American and don't know all the info about Obama's administration other than some of his international speeches and a bit of foreign policy, can you elaborate as to why you think that?


I'll sure try...

What he's said he was going to do hasn't happened except for changing America so that we're all the same. The wars haven't stopped. GITMO hasn't been closed yet. People are not back to work and in fact more people are out of work than almost ever before.

We have far too many people asking for help than ever before. I cannot afford to pay for them anymore.

He has put of further in debt. This debt is only. Y kids kids head and they haven't been born yet.

I'd love to have this debate with anyone because more often than not I come out of it learning but it is so hard to get a left leaning person to debate without calling me names.

I come to this great we page because of Formula One but I have no problem talking about other subjects.




I'll also add that despite many promises to the contrary, Obama has used more Executive Orders (now called "Memos") to bypass Congress than any President since Carter(?).

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /20191805/


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:25 am 
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Steve C wrote:
minchy wrote:
Steve C wrote:
What a total joke our president is. He is Santa Claus and our public is too stupid to figure it out.

For the benefit of those of us who aren't American and don't know all the info about Obama's administration other than some of his international speeches and a bit of foreign policy, can you elaborate as to why you think that?


I'll sure try...

What he's said he was going to do hasn't happened except for changing America so that we're all the same. The wars haven't stopped. GITMO hasn't been closed yet. People are not back to work and in fact more people are out of work than almost ever before.


On the other thread you are advocating that the strong and immediate action be taken against the Islamic terrorist, that our Gov'ts know where they are and that they should go out for them and finished them all... or otherwise we are all doomed. And here you go, calling your president of your Gov't a 'total joke' for not closing Gitmo yet and go fighting ISIS (just see, the wars haven't stopped). So what do you really want from your Gov't, to go fighting and killing/imprisoning those, or letting them be free?

As far as your claim that today people in the US are in fact more out of work than almost ever before... Have a look at this chart of unemployment rates in last 10 years. What you will see is that since 2008 and 2009, the time when the global recession and economical crises hit the world and the unemployment in the US hit its peak of 10%, the rates have been steadily declining and today they are there where they have been in 2002, on 5.5%. That would be some 50% of previously unemployed people in 2009, getting employed during this latest period of 5 years.

http://www.macrotrends.net/1339/unemplo ... -ten-years


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:43 am 
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HawaiiF1Fan wrote:

I'll also add that despite many promises to the contrary, Obama has used more Executive Orders (now called "Memos") to bypass Congress than any President since Carter(?).

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /20191805/


At the same time, Obama has been probably one of the most undercut and sabotaged president. The recent shut down of the government by the side of Republicans just for the sake of exposing the president as incapable of presidency, tells it all. It's all political games. Either Obama was to be a sitting duck there in the White House and not be able to accomplish just anything due to the opposition using all the legal means at their disposal to bind his arms behind his back, or he was to use all the available legal means to unbind himself and do something. And then the right wing, through their mouthpieces such as FOX-news, will size the opportunity to expose him as a dictator. Obama was to be maneuvered so to be exposed as either a completely useless and incapable president (which he indeed would have been was he not to circumambulate the obstructors in this way), or he was otherwise to be depicted as a dictator that is destroying the Constitution.

Frankly speaking, I am quite surprised that those right wing extremists "freedom fighters" in the US have not shot him yet.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:49 pm 
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I bet 3/4 of the people speaking on this subject do even call themselves Americans. How can you have even vote for something you know so little about?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:16 pm 
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Prema wrote:
HawaiiF1Fan wrote:

I'll also add that despite many promises to the contrary, Obama has used more Executive Orders (now called "Memos") to bypass Congress than any President since Carter(?).

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /20191805/


At the same time, Obama has been probably one of the most undercut and sabotaged president. The recent shut down of the government by the side of Republicans just for the sake of exposing the president as incapable of presidency, tells it all. It's all political games. Either Obama was to be a sitting duck there in the White House and not be able to accomplish just anything due to the opposition using all the legal means at their disposal to bind his arms behind his back, or he was to use all the available legal means to unbind himself and do something. And then the right wing, through their mouthpieces such as FOX-news, will size the opportunity to expose him as a dictator. Obama was to be maneuvered so to be exposed as either a completely useless and incapable president (which he indeed would have been was he not to circumambulate the obstructors in this way), or he was otherwise to be depicted as a dictator that is destroying the Constitution.

Frankly speaking, I am quite surprised that those right wing extremists "freedom fighters" in the US have not shot him yet.


One of his own would probably shot him, since he's let them down... But that's just talk, I don't anybody to die senselessly.

It's obvious to even me, Prema, that you hate America and that's fine with me.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:20 pm 
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Steve C wrote:
Prema wrote:
HawaiiF1Fan wrote:

I'll also add that despite many promises to the contrary, Obama has used more Executive Orders (now called "Memos") to bypass Congress than any President since Carter(?).

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /20191805/


At the same time, Obama has been probably one of the most undercut and sabotaged president. The recent shut down of the government by the side of Republicans just for the sake of exposing the president as incapable of presidency, tells it all. It's all political games. Either Obama was to be a sitting duck there in the White House and not be able to accomplish just anything due to the opposition using all the legal means at their disposal to bind his arms behind his back, or he was to use all the available legal means to unbind himself and do something. And then the right wing, through their mouthpieces such as FOX-news, will size the opportunity to expose him as a dictator. Obama was to be maneuvered so to be exposed as either a completely useless and incapable president (which he indeed would have been was he not to circumambulate the obstructors in this way), or he was otherwise to be depicted as a dictator that is destroying the Constitution.

Frankly speaking, I am quite surprised that those right wing extremists "freedom fighters" in the US have not shot him yet.


One of his own would probably shot him, since he's let them down... But that's just talk, I don't anybody to die senselessly.

It's obvious to even me, Prema, that you hate America and that's fine with me.


In this particular instance I stood in support for your President, spoke a bit about the bitter political games between the two parties in Washington, and I expressed myself negatively about the extreme right wing in the USA (that you personally identify yourself with). And right away, you proclaim me a hater of America. That is the problem of radicalism, never mind be it right or left or religious. Hate. They see it everywhere where there is not an agreement with their extremist ideas. And they will extrapolate that hate as a global hate. If you at least would say that I hate your right winger views and your "freedom fighter" guys. Ok. But no. It is the entire America that I hate. That is exactly the sign of extremism. Like, you and your "freedom fighters" are America and those who don't share your views must be the haters of America.

Even on that other thread, you keep insisting that those posters expressing their views which are not up to your likening, that they are fighting against you. That is, again, extreme. You are seeing enemies everywhere. People are just discussing their views, don't you remember... freedom? You got to tolerate the freedom of other people, if not... it's your problem you got to deal with.


Last edited by Prema on Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:25 pm 
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As I'm not American and live in Thailand, I rate Obama reasonably well (but haven't voted) 'cos he hasn't started any wars yet :) .

He's relatively new to power though, so this may change as he realises that the only way to retain power is to pander to ignorant populace that think its good for the US to prove their military superiority over other nations.

Not to mention the wealthy business men that are looking to extend their interests in countries that have resources that are less exploited than in the US.

Mind you, this doesn't just apply to the US - European governments are just as bad in this respect.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:36 pm 
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Steve C wrote:
I bet 3/4 of the people speaking on this subject do even call themselves Americans. How can you have even vote for something you know so little about?


Although I am certainly quite not knowledgable on the subject, I most probably still know more about American political situation than quite some Americans. If nothing else, at least I can correctly identify Joe Biden as the current Vice President, something almost 1/3 of Americans could not when asked to take a simple citizenship test. Just being American, or having the feelings of patriotism, is not any given guaranty to be automatically more knowledgeable on the subject of the US Presidency and the politics there than anybody else who may happen to not call him/herself American. Look, for example, you did not know about the unemployment rates in the USA and you wrongly took for factual something that was a complete hoax. Were you to happen to watch John Steward show, you would know it as he was exposing anti-Obama propaganda lies of Fox-news in that particular regard.

In any case, this is rather the international forum and the poll and the OP was oriented to it in that way.

------------
A little anecdote on this same note:

On one of my trips to Vegas, I had enough of the Strip and the casinos and all that, so I decided to rent a car for a few days and rather explore the scenaries outside of the city. And the guy asked me for a driving licence, which I showed up, on his surprise, "Oh, it's not american... then I will need your passport too". I showed that one, asking him, "But couldn't you notice from my accent that I was not an American?" (English not even being my first language), on what he replied, "Oh, you speak English better than many Americans around here".


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