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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:30 pm 
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moby wrote:
Worth a read


http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-terror ... ar/5382818

...obesity is a a contributing factor in 100,000–400,000 deaths in the United States per year. That makes obesity 5,882 to times 23,528 more likely to kill you than a terrorist.

Not directly comparable, but to put it in prospective



Oh goody, yet another thing to help me feel good this morning, as I am not exactly skinny either... No values AND over weight!

:(

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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:56 pm 
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Blake wrote:
I love the idea of a world where none of this happens... No attacks, no spying, no painful interrogations. I just don't know how to get there, do you or any one else in here? If so lead the way!
In a utopian world, I'd say we need to follow the Star Trek way - abolish money for the philosophy of bettering ourselves individually and as a species. (But of course that's a long way off if it ever happens and will require the world to be a whole rather than 100's of different factions/countries/religions etc).

And I'm a fat smoker, so at least you've less to feel bad about than me ;)

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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 3:49 pm 
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Blake wrote:
moby wrote:
Worth a read


http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-terror ... ar/5382818

...obesity is a a contributing factor in 100,000–400,000 deaths in the United States per year. That makes obesity 5,882 to times 23,528 more likely to kill you than a terrorist.

Not directly comparable, but to put it in prospective



Oh goody, yet another thing to help me feel good this morning, as I am not exactly skinny either... No values AND over weight!

:(


I am overweight, like all the wrong foods, drink way too much, dont do half enough exercise and live in UK where we have had a "terrorist problem" for more than 50 years, but what the hell, you gotta go sometime, just as well enjoy it while you are here.


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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 6:32 pm 
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Blake wrote:
I have asked just what these other methods that many have said are available to the intelligence workers to try to thwart that next attack if we keep tying their hands by taking away resources, but I don't see anybody coming up with answers, only more condemnations.

I fully understand that the U.S. has been a factor in creating the anger and frustrations that have led to the increase in terrorism. I am not proud of a lot of what we have done. I am interested very much though in what is done now... today... to keep my country safe. I have over repeatedly said that I don't like torture, but I understand that there are people who have information who are not just going to volunteer it when it would mean exposing their cause an mission. So tell me, how do the intelligence gatherers charged national safety for our countries,get that information to save lives before the attack rather than reacting retroactively?


Blake, the point is that it really does not make a difference wether it is the US or North Korea or China or Russia or Syria... No matter what act, the given justification is just the same one: to keep country and people safe. But the sceptic in me keeps telling me that the similarity is not only in the form of justification, but also in the content of the very acts. Unfortunately, people's well being and their protection is not the foremost interest of the mentioned governments (the White House not being any exception). Keeping power is what comes first and foremost. The US could easily keep the country and their people safe simply by not trying to be the dominant and controlling power in the world (just how many American lives have been saved by going to Vietnam and having 1 mil of Vietnamese killed there?)

The atom bombing of Japan has been mentioned here, and not without any connection to this very topic of systematic torture of enemies. Simply said, there seems not to be lines. No moral considerations. Whatever it takes, whenever the suitable time for it. A guy walks downtown Jerusalem, stripped with a bomb and blows up himself and few other people. It is terrorism. Clearly, no doubt. Condemned. Well, a guy flies over and drops one atom bomb on a town. And then, as if not enough, another one in just a couple of days on another town. Something like 200 000 people killed. Two cities gone. And suddenly, that is not to be considered an act of terror but an act of "saving American lives". Suddenly, there is a rational behind it just like there is behind the torturing. But really, was there really even a need? Those several thousands of American lives (of the soldiers, as speculated so in a proposed American invasion of Japan) would be saved by letting Stalin's Red Army to take up to the part in it (as reportedly there had already been a secret agreement in place). The WW2 was already practically over, Japan was in a blockade and practically defeated. But the Cold War has already started. The US got to hurry up with finishing off Japan as soon as possible, not let Soviets anywhere near Japan (dividing and sharing Germany with Communists had been already more than it could be digested), and emerge out as the new, dominant power of the new order in the world. It was more in a political purpose than even a military one. Anyway, if you don't mind to have a look at some testimonies and statements that are not exactly the typical US high school books' material:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-real-r ... es/5308192

Even if you would have a difficult time to agree with some of it, the fact remains that the most destructive weapons of mass distraction so far have been used by the US not as the ultimate self-defense weapon for the sake of preservation/protection of own country and people there. The target, the purpose, the meaning, the execution of it... it all perfectly checks: an act of terror.

Don't get me wrong. This is not about anti-US sentiment. It is so that the US is being reported here on practicing systematic torture, so the credit goes where due. Give me another country, and I will have a word or two there, too. And personally, if the choice already is between Russia, China, North Korea, ISIS or the US... stay assured that I am on the same page with you: I chose the US. But I obviously don't subscribe to the given rationalization as why would it be acceptable for the US only to disregard whatever moral, ethical, humane lines of conducts that are being perceived as wrong and evil with the others, the enemies of the US. The rationalizations are just the same on all the sides.


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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 12:26 am 
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Posts: 290
Blake wrote:
moby wrote:
Worth a read


http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-terror ... ar/5382818

...obesity is a a contributing factor in 100,000–400,000 deaths in the United States per year. That makes obesity 5,882 to times 23,528 more likely to kill you than a terrorist.

Not directly comparable, but to put it in prospective



Oh goody, yet another thing to help me feel good this morning, as I am not exactly skinny either... No values AND over weight!

:(


I'd rather die eating than at the hands of a terrorist. Freedom


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 Post subject: Re: CIA torture report
PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 3:12 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:22 pm
Posts: 8029
Steve C wrote:
Blake wrote:
moby wrote:
Worth a read


http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-terror ... ar/5382818

...obesity is a a contributing factor in 100,000–400,000 deaths in the United States per year. That makes obesity 5,882 to times 23,528 more likely to kill you than a terrorist.

Not directly comparable, but to put it in prospective



Oh goody, yet another thing to help me feel good this morning, as I am not exactly skinny either... No values AND over weight!

:(


I'd rather die eating than at the hands of a terrorist. Freedom



+ you chose to eat it :D


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