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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:28 am 
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Yeah i'd say the season is now pretty much a write off. At least the 1st half.

Might as well turn full steam to development for 2021.

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Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Australia - 20) - 139 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 363 trophies available, 26 won

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:31 am 
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According to the CDC, in the US alone at least 15 million flu illnesses have been reported so far during the current 2019 – 20 season, resulting in 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths in the US.

Why is Italy closed up over 29 deaths? (the most recent number I can locate)

According to the virologists and an old chemist friend with a whack ton of those Masters/PHD letters, former head of the department at a large Texas university I can find there ain't even a proper test that is capable of actually identifying COVID-19 "specifically" as the current one being used cannot tell it from the common CDC flu noted above.

The ‘gold standard’ is laboratory isolated/purified coronavirus particles free from any contaminants and particles that look like viruses but are not, that have been proven to be the cause of the syndrome known as COVID-19 and obtained by using proper viral isolation methods and controls (not PCR or Serology /antibody tests which do not detect virus as such).

This will never happen (short of a miracle!) because of the various constraints imposed on mainstream virologists and microbiologists. So yes, no isolated virus = no gold standard of comparison for any genetic material found, therefore no coronavirus and no COVID-19 per se apart from opportunistic flu type infections that are common and pneumonia grouped under that acronym to ‘fit the frame’.

You can debate this issue till the cows come home, but only concrete scientific proof of this virus and proof of its ability to cause disease with proper controls, will determine the truth of the matter leaving aside all of the other possible issues I discussed above and below.

I seem to recall that in 2003, media spread fear-mongering about a SARS pandemic proved to be way overblown, only 800 deaths were reported after the hysteria subsided.

That same year, 42,643 people in the US were killed in 6,328,000 police-reported motor vehicle accidents and 2,889,000 people were injured.

Back in 2009, the WHO falsely predicted a global Swine flu H1N1 pandemic that could affect “as many as two billion people over the next two years.” I don't recall that happening, do you?

Fear-mongering at the time seemed purposely aimed to convince people to take experimental, untested, toxic and extremely dangerous vaccines that can damage the human immune system and cause health problems ranging from annoying to life-threatening and folks still ask me why I never had a flu shot in my entire life - cus I read everything, the good the bad and the ugly, heck the only medicines in my cabinet are Ibuprofen, Phenylephrine HCl 10 mg for sinus, Nacent Iodine and Pascalite - all available without a prescription, (most men my age take blood pressure and a whack ton of other junk their docs prescribed, but I ain't broke yet and don't need fixin and thankfully my GP doc accepts my orneriness).

A similar scenario is in play today, IMHO, cus I remember the lies told in the past.

I could care less how many NBA, MLB or NFL games they cancel, I don't watch'em, but a there is only one driver in a F1 car (which I do watch religiously) so how pray tell me me is he gonna catch anything wearing full race gear and a helmet at 200 mph? And if a race fan decides he wants to show up and watch a race that's his decision and risk to take, again IMHO. (shoot they even closed the local nursing home meaning I no longer get to visit my more elderly than I family members - not even to tell them why I can't come as usual)

ps - my son called me today because I'm of an age at which "someone/somewhere" seems to think I'm highly vulnerable to COVID-19 and I'll tell you folks what I told him - this whole virus manure don't pass the smell test (cus the numbers are all over the place and they stink to high heaven) with me and when ya get to be my age ya get pretty good at recognizing a lie no-matter what globalist's organizations on the planet are shoveling it.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:54 am 
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.

PLEASE look at the very many proper scientific explanations of the Covid-19 pandemic on the web - it is nothing, really, to do with simple figures, it is about the wildly different results of infections and the total population infection percentage ( 80%-plus ). This means that vulnerable people will likely be exposed. In addition, the aim of most governments is to limit the peak numbers so as to not overwhelm medical resources and spread the load. Most people will hardly notice their infection, but they MAY pass it on to vulnerable people.

Do not believe the Trump school of pseudo-science - this is merely politics masquerading as "common sense" which is actually rubbish


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:05 am 
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F1nut wrote:
According to the CDC, in the US alone at least 15 million flu illnesses have been reported so far during the current 2019 – 20 season, resulting in 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths in the US.

Why is Italy closed up over 29 deaths? (the most recent number I can locate)


I don't know when you found your most recent number. There are more than 1000 deaths in Italy since yesterday.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:39 am 
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F1nut wrote:

Why is Italy closed up over 29 deaths? (the most recent number I can locate)



Wiki page is a good way to get up to date numbers

also when comapring numbers you have to factor in time periods. First confirmed death was only Jan 9th so 5k deaths in 3 mths.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:46 am 
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Greenman wrote:
.

PLEASE look at the very many proper scientific explanations of the Covid-19 pandemic on the web - it is nothing, really, to do with simple figures, it is about the wildly different results of infections and the total population infection percentage ( 80%-plus ). This means that vulnerable people will likely be exposed. In addition, the aim of most governments is to limit the peak numbers so as to not overwhelm medical resources and spread the load. Most people will hardly notice their infection, but they MAY pass it on to vulnerable people.

Do not believe the Trump school of pseudo-science - this is merely politics masquerading as "common sense" which is actually rubbish


Then if that's the case, & I don't necessarily disagree with you, perhaps it's time for the so called "experts" to quite doing the rounds of the mass media, who these days are more interested in making the news instead of reporting it, & inciting a global frenzy by talking worst case scenario numbers as if it's a forgone conclusion.

There are more people who live in my small little street in Australia than have tested positive for the virus but you'd swear the way it's being reported & the way people are acting the government was about to introduce marshal law.

Australia is perfectly positioned to get out of this with little effect (1st world, non-contiguous country with easily controlled points of entry. a small population & world leading health care), in fact i'd say we'd be one of the "places to be", during the pandemic, but if you look on google you mostly get is doom & gloom reporting.

It's no wonder people get cynical & it's no wonder the people in first world countries are turning towards the more nationalist, right wing parties & away from the globalist, left wing parties.

I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.

_________________
Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Australia - 20) - 139 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 363 trophies available, 26 won

2017 WCC CPTTC - Jalopy Racing (Herb & Me)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:35 am 
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Jezza13 wrote:
Greenman wrote:
.

PLEASE look at the very many proper scientific explanations of the Covid-19 pandemic on the web - it is nothing, really, to do with simple figures, it is about the wildly different results of infections and the total population infection percentage ( 80%-plus ). This means that vulnerable people will likely be exposed. In addition, the aim of most governments is to limit the peak numbers so as to not overwhelm medical resources and spread the load. Most people will hardly notice their infection, but they MAY pass it on to vulnerable people.

Do not believe the Trump school of pseudo-science - this is merely politics masquerading as "common sense" which is actually rubbish


Then if that's the case, & I don't necessarily disagree with you, perhaps it's time for the so called "experts" to quite doing the rounds of the mass media, who these days are more interested in making the news instead of reporting it, & inciting a global frenzy by talking worst case scenario numbers as if it's a forgone conclusion.

There are more people who live in my small little street in Australia than have tested positive for the virus but you'd swear the way it's being reported & the way people are acting the government was about to introduce marshal law.

Australia is perfectly positioned to get out of this with little effect (1st world, non-contiguous country with easily controlled points of entry. a small population & world leading health care), in fact i'd say we'd be one of the "places to be", during the pandemic, but if you look on google you mostly get is doom & gloom reporting.

It's no wonder people get cynical & it's no wonder the people in first world countries are turning towards the more nationalist, right wing parties & away from the globalist, left wing parties.

I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.

Did the United States get forced to answer for the 1918 Spanish Flu? China is the most populated country with the most number of highly populated cities. These diseases are statistically most likely to start there. And the West has been the source of its fair share of epidemics in recent times as well.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:05 am 
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F1nut wrote:
According to the CDC, in the US alone at least 15 million flu illnesses have been reported so far during the current 2019 – 20 season, resulting in 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths in the US.

Why is Italy closed up over 29 deaths? (the most recent number I can locate)

According to the virologists and an old chemist friend with a whack ton of those Masters/PHD letters, former head of the department at a large Texas university I can find there ain't even a proper test that is capable of actually identifying COVID-19 "specifically" as the current one being used cannot tell it from the common CDC flu noted above.

The ‘gold standard’ is laboratory isolated/purified coronavirus particles free from any contaminants and particles that look like viruses but are not, that have been proven to be the cause of the syndrome known as COVID-19 and obtained by using proper viral isolation methods and controls (not PCR or Serology /antibody tests which do not detect virus as such).

This will never happen (short of a miracle!) because of the various constraints imposed on mainstream virologists and microbiologists. So yes, no isolated virus = no gold standard of comparison for any genetic material found, therefore no coronavirus and no COVID-19 per se apart from opportunistic flu type infections that are common and pneumonia grouped under that acronym to ‘fit the frame’.

You can debate this issue till the cows come home, but only concrete scientific proof of this virus and proof of its ability to cause disease with proper controls, will determine the truth of the matter leaving aside all of the other possible issues I discussed above and below.

I seem to recall that in 2003, media spread fear-mongering about a SARS pandemic proved to be way overblown, only 800 deaths were reported after the hysteria subsided.

That same year, 42,643 people in the US were killed in 6,328,000 police-reported motor vehicle accidents and 2,889,000 people were injured.

Back in 2009, the WHO falsely predicted a global Swine flu H1N1 pandemic that could affect “as many as two billion people over the next two years.” I don't recall that happening, do you?

Fear-mongering at the time seemed purposely aimed to convince people to take experimental, untested, toxic and extremely dangerous vaccines that can damage the human immune system and cause health problems ranging from annoying to life-threatening and folks still ask me why I never had a flu shot in my entire life - cus I read everything, the good the bad and the ugly, heck the only medicines in my cabinet are Ibuprofen, Phenylephrine HCl 10 mg for sinus, Nacent Iodine and Pascalite - all available without a prescription, (most men my age take blood pressure and a whack ton of other junk their docs prescribed, but I ain't broke yet and don't need fixin and thankfully my GP doc accepts my orneriness).

A similar scenario is in play today, IMHO, cus I remember the lies told in the past.

I could care less how many NBA, MLB or NFL games they cancel, I don't watch'em, but a there is only one driver in a F1 car (which I do watch religiously) so how pray tell me me is he gonna catch anything wearing full race gear and a helmet at 200 mph? And if a race fan decides he wants to show up and watch a race that's his decision and risk to take, again IMHO. (shoot they even closed the local nursing home meaning I no longer get to visit my more elderly than I family members - not even to tell them why I can't come as usual)

ps - my son called me today because I'm of an age at which "someone/somewhere" seems to think I'm highly vulnerable to COVID-19 and I'll tell you folks what I told him - this whole virus manure don't pass the smell test (cus the numbers are all over the place and they stink to high heaven) with me and when ya get to be my age ya get pretty good at recognizing a lie no-matter what globalist's organizations on the planet are shoveling it.


You have some good points, but with some other stuff you can't be serious, right? They won't catch the virus in the car during the race only, but in the airport, bus, train, anywhere. Mechanics from the teams tested positive in the paddock the other day...

As for the people, this is how it is transmitted, hence large gatherings should be avoided. This kind of mentality (their risk) is why people spread it instead of try and be a bit more careful or isolate if they have the symptoms. It is not their risk to take, unless you think that infecting others is fine. There are cases that the person didn't know they had it and gave it to other people. And it is not only about this virus, this goes for the normal flu/virus too. If you have it, stay at home, don't try and impress your boss by coming to the office to show how brave little soldier you are, sneezing it around and spreading it to everyone. It is common sense really.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:08 am 
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F1nut wrote:
According to the CDC, in the US alone at least 15 million flu illnesses have been reported so far during the current 2019 – 20 season, resulting in 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths in the US.

Why is Italy closed up over 29 deaths? (the most recent number I can locate)

As has been repeated mentioned, Italy has over 1,000 deaths. With a population roughly 1/5th of the USA, this is a equivalent of 5,000 deaths in the USA - once it hits 1,700 it will have surpassed the equivalent of 8,200 deaths in the USA.

The infection rate is much much lower proportionately - and that's the issue. You are 20 times as likely to die if you get COVID-19 than if you get the seasonal flu.

F1nut wrote:
According to the virologists and an old chemist friend with a whack ton of those Masters/PHD letters, former head of the department at a large Texas university I can find there ain't even a proper test that is capable of actually identifying COVID-19 "specifically" as the current one being used cannot tell it from the common CDC flu noted above.

The ‘gold standard’ is laboratory isolated/purified coronavirus particles free from any contaminants and particles that look like viruses but are not, that have been proven to be the cause of the syndrome known as COVID-19 and obtained by using proper viral isolation methods and controls (not PCR or Serology /antibody tests which do not detect virus as such).

I'm not sure what your point is? Test kit accuracy is never as certain as lab testing for obvious reasons - but one thing is certain than this is that a highly contagious, new strain of flu for which he have no cure or vaccine for is spreading across the globe. All scientific experiments and measurements - even very simple ones - come with error bars.
F1nut wrote:
I seem to recall that in 2003, media spread fear-mongering about a SARS pandemic proved to be way overblown, only 800 deaths were reported after the hysteria subsided.

First: there have already been 5,000 deaths from COVID-19 and that number is rising expotentially.

Second: That figure was 800 was not the number that died after people did nothing. It was *only* 800 because steps were taken to stop it spreading further...

F1nut wrote:
That same year, 42,643 people in the US were killed in 6,328,000 police-reported motor vehicle accidents and 2,889,000 people were injured.

Back in 2009, the WHO falsely predicted a global Swine flu H1N1 pandemic that could affect “as many as two billion people over the next two years.” I don't recall that happening, do you?

They didn't falsely predict. As many as two billion people could have died if nothing was done. Two billion people didn't die because steps were taken to stop that number from dying!
F1nut wrote:
Fear-mongering at the time seemed purposely aimed to convince people to take experimental, untested, toxic and extremely dangerous vaccines that can damage the human immune system and cause health problems ranging from annoying to life-threatening and folks still ask me why I never had a flu shot in my entire life - cus I read everything, the good the bad and the ugly, heck the only medicines in my cabinet are Ibuprofen, Phenylephrine HCl 10 mg for sinus, Nacent Iodine and Pascalite - all available without a prescription, (most men my age take blood pressure and a whack ton of other junk their docs prescribed, but I ain't broke yet and don't need fixin and thankfully my GP doc accepts my orneriness).

A similar scenario is in play today, IMHO, cus I remember the lies told in the past.

I could care less how many NBA, MLB or NFL games they cancel, I don't watch'em, but a there is only one driver in a F1 car (which I do watch religiously) so how pray tell me me is he gonna catch anything wearing full race gear and a helmet at 200 mph? And if a race fan decides he wants to show up and watch a race that's his decision and risk to take, again IMHO. (shoot they even closed the local nursing home meaning I no longer get to visit my more elderly than I family members - not even to tell them why I can't come as usual)

The elderly are the most likely to die as their immune systems are the most compromised. This is one of the reasons Italy has seen such a high death rate (6%, 3-6 times higher than the global average) - Italy has a very large elderly population.
F1nut wrote:
ps - my son called me today because I'm of an age at which "someone/somewhere" seems to think I'm highly vulnerable to COVID-19 and I'll tell you folks what I told him - this whole virus manure don't pass the smell test (cus the numbers are all over the place and they stink to high heaven) with me and when ya get to be my age ya get pretty good at recognizing a lie no-matter what globalist's organizations on the planet are shoveling it.

Someone, somewhere, with access to the raw data that unambiguously shows that people over the age of 80 have a 15% chance of death if they contract the disease and people ages 70-79 have an 8% chance.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:13 am 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Greenman wrote:
.

PLEASE look at the very many proper scientific explanations of the Covid-19 pandemic on the web - it is nothing, really, to do with simple figures, it is about the wildly different results of infections and the total population infection percentage ( 80%-plus ). This means that vulnerable people will likely be exposed. In addition, the aim of most governments is to limit the peak numbers so as to not overwhelm medical resources and spread the load. Most people will hardly notice their infection, but they MAY pass it on to vulnerable people.

Do not believe the Trump school of pseudo-science - this is merely politics masquerading as "common sense" which is actually rubbish


Then if that's the case, & I don't necessarily disagree with you, perhaps it's time for the so called "experts" to quite doing the rounds of the mass media, who these days are more interested in making the news instead of reporting it, & inciting a global frenzy by talking worst case scenario numbers as if it's a forgone conclusion.

There are more people who live in my small little street in Australia than have tested positive for the virus but you'd swear the way it's being reported & the way people are acting the government was about to introduce marshal law.

Australia is perfectly positioned to get out of this with little effect (1st world, non-contiguous country with easily controlled points of entry. a small population & world leading health care), in fact i'd say we'd be one of the "places to be", during the pandemic, but if you look on google you mostly get is doom & gloom reporting.

It's no wonder people get cynical & it's no wonder the people in first world countries are turning towards the more nationalist, right wing parties & away from the globalist, left wing parties.

I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.

Did the United States get forced to answer for the 1918 Spanish Flu? China is the most populated country with the most number of highly populated cities. These diseases are statistically most likely to start there. And the West has been the source of its fair share of epidemics in recent times as well.


Did it originate in the US? I know it was first reported there but isn't there a lack of consensus as to it's place of origin? I also think comparing living conditions today with war time conditions 100 yrs ago is a tad reaching.

China is the 2nd richest country in the world & well on it's way to becoming the richest & the last 2 pandemics have originated in China (Corona & SARS). I'm certainly not advocating for them to pay compensation or anything like that, but I think that any county that has been identified as having an epidemic start in their county, should be held to account and made to give certain undertakings to improve health standards & mitigate the chances of these things re-occurring.

I don't know. Maybe that's already the case.

_________________
Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Australia - 20) - 139 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 363 trophies available, 26 won

2017 WCC CPTTC - Jalopy Racing (Herb & Me)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:26 am 
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Jezza13 wrote:
I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.


What other pandemic that you know of that "originated" from China?
Otherwise, hold your horses before you decide whom to call on here.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19- ... us/5706078

Who's to tell?


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:46 am 
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Prema wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.


What other pandemic that you know of that "originated" from China?
Otherwise, hold your horses before you decide whom to call on here.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19- ... us/5706078

Who's to tell?



SARS

So a Chinese media outlet is 1 of 2 sources for this report carried by the Centre for Research on Globalisation.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-start-originate-conspiracy-china-us-wuhan-cdc-robert-redfield-a9398711.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/12/conspiracy-theory-that-coronavirus-originated-in-us-gaining-traction-in-china

I think i'll stick with the origin of the virus being China for the time being.

_________________
Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Australia - 20) - 139 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 363 trophies available, 26 won

2017 WCC CPTTC - Jalopy Racing (Herb & Me)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:47 am 
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How about they pick one country with the most FIA Grade 1 circuits - or configurations of a circuit - and run as many races as possible there to tide the championship over until some travel can resume.

This would eliminate the international travel risk...

By my reckoning (according to Wiki) you could get 5 races out of Bahrain, or France (1 Magny-Cours, 4 Paul Ricard).

I'd get pretty bored of Bahrain & so would the drivers, but would be great to see a Magny-Cours race!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:54 am 
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Christ, does Andrew Benson even think about or read what he writes:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/51846341
Quote:
Vietnam's first Formula 1 race is scheduled to be held on 5 April but the country has said it will refuse entry to anyone who has been to Italy in the previous 14 days.
That would mean Alfa Romeo's Antonio Giovinazzi and personnel from Ferrari and Alpha Tauri and tyre supplier Pirelli could not enter the country.


Given that Giovinazzi, Ferrari, Alpha Tauri & Pirelli have until a few hours ago all been in Australia, and there are approximately 19 days before they have to enter Vietnam, this won't be the reason that race gets cancelled. In theory all they'd have to do is avoid going back to Italy.

Edit: parroted by Dan Roan too:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/51871615


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:05 pm 
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Jezza13 wrote:
Prema wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.


What other pandemic that you know of that "originated" from China?
Otherwise, hold your horses before you decide whom to call on here.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19- ... us/5706078

Who's to tell?



SARS

So a Chinese media outlet is 1 of 2 sources for this report carried by the Centre for Research on Globalisation.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-start-originate-conspiracy-china-us-wuhan-cdc-robert-redfield-a9398711.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/12/conspiracy-theory-that-coronavirus-originated-in-us-gaining-traction-in-china

I think i'll stick with the origin of the virus being China for the time being.


SARS was an epidemic, not pandemic


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:15 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
Prema wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:
I wonder when global nations will finally call on China to answer for the pandemics that mostly seem to originate there? My guess is it won't happen.


What other pandemic that you know of that "originated" from China?
Otherwise, hold your horses before you decide whom to call on here.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/covid-19- ... us/5706078

Who's to tell?



SARS

So a Chinese media outlet is 1 of 2 sources for this report carried by the Centre for Research on Globalisation.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-start-originate-conspiracy-china-us-wuhan-cdc-robert-redfield-a9398711.html

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/12/conspiracy-theory-that-coronavirus-originated-in-us-gaining-traction-in-china

I think i'll stick with the origin of the virus being China for the time being.


SARS was an epidemic, not pandemic


Yep. Fair cop.

Based on that info, I therefor & hereby retract my demand for China to be held accountable as I mistakenly believed this was the 2nd time around for them..

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Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Australia - 20) - 139 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 363 trophies available, 26 won

2017 WCC CPTTC - Jalopy Racing (Herb & Me)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:40 pm 
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There goes Bahrain and Vietnam...

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:40 pm 
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Both the Bahrain Grand Prix and Vietnam Grand Prix have officially been postponed


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 1:07 pm 
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FIA and F1 still can’t agree in their statements. F1 say the season will start at the end of May, FIA say the start of May. As it happens, they’ll probably both be wrong.

Shambolic few days for the pair of them.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 1:20 pm 
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Jezza13 wrote:

Did it originate in the US? I know it was first reported there but isn't there a lack of consensus as to it's place of origin?


As far as I know (which is not that far), the Spanish Flu came from the USA to Europe with the US army. It's called Spanish because Spain being not involved in the world war (and therefore not submitted to censorship) all information about the pandemic was of Spanish origin.
It came from the USA, where it mutated, but the origin is supposed to be... China.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 1:32 pm 
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Harpo wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:

Did it originate in the US? I know it was first reported there but isn't there a lack of consensus as to it's place of origin?


As far as I know (which is not that far), the Spanish Flu came from the USA to Europe with the US army. It's called Spanish because Spain being not involved in the world war (and therefore not submitted to censorship) all information about the pandemic was of Spanish origin.
It came from the USA, where it mutated, but the origin is supposed to be... China.

It originated in US military based in Kansas but was spread and cultivated amongst Chinese soldiers serving in the US Military who had been forced to cram in a train to hide them from the US population in North Eastern states because at the time there was a major problem with racism towards Chinese people in that part of America.

Due to the cramped conditions of the train, and because the American soldiers were under strict instructions not to let the soldiers out of the carriages until they reached the port n Canada, the virus spread like wildfire through the Chinese soldiers on the train, who were then loaded onto a boat and shipped to Europe which made the situation far worse.

It then spread throughout the Allied trenches, including the British (who then took it back to the UK mainland) - but they surpressed news of it so the Germans didn't sense a tactical advantage. However, it didn't matter because it had also spread to those trenches and the Germans were also surpressing news of it.

As you correctly stated, Spain was the first non combatant to suffer from it and make it known - hence why it's called the Spanish flu - however it spread through the USA, just more slowly due to not having the catalyst of the train/boat ride that accelerated it for the Chinese soldiers, from the original epicentre of the Kansas military base.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 1:50 pm 
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Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Harpo wrote:
Jezza13 wrote:

Did it originate in the US? I know it was first reported there but isn't there a lack of consensus as to it's place of origin?


As far as I know (which is not that far), the Spanish Flu came from the USA to Europe with the US army. It's called Spanish because Spain being not involved in the world war (and therefore not submitted to censorship) all information about the pandemic was of Spanish origin.
It came from the USA, where it mutated, but the origin is supposed to be... China.

It originated in US military based in Kansas but was spread and cultivated amongst Chinese soldiers serving in the US Military who had been forced to cram in a train to hide them from the US population in North Eastern states because at the time there was a major problem with racism towards Chinese people in that part of America.

Due to the cramped conditions of the train, and because the American soldiers were under strict instructions not to let the soldiers out of the carriages until they reached the port n Canada, the virus spread like wildfire through the Chinese soldiers on the train, who were then loaded onto a boat and shipped to Europe which made the situation far worse.

It then spread throughout the Allied trenches, including the British (who then took it back to the UK mainland) - but they surpressed news of it so the Germans didn't sense a tactical advantage. However, it didn't matter because it had also spread to those trenches and the Germans were also surpressing news of it.

As you correctly stated, Spain was the first non combatant to suffer from it and make it known - hence why it's called the Spanish flu - however it spread through the USA, just more slowly due to not having the catalyst of the train/boat ride that accelerated it for the Chinese soldiers, from the original epicentre of the Kansas military base.


Thanks for the details.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 1:52 pm 
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https://twitter.com/tgruener/status/123 ... 27040?s=21

Talk of races in summer break or 2020 races being completed in 2021 and 2022 being the new regulations.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:05 pm 
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So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:20 pm 
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Vettel Fan wrote:
So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.



More people are going to die due to the economic impact than the virus itself.
(World in general not just economic impact of F1)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:23 pm 
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Vettel Fan wrote:
So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.

tell that to the dead and dying.
:x

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:31 pm 
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Zazu wrote:
Vettel Fan wrote:
So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.



More people are going to die due to the economic impact than the virus itself.
(World in general not just economic impact of F1)


If they stab each other over some toilet paper, then I'd imagine so!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:43 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
FIA and F1 still can’t agree in their statements. F1 say the season will start at the end of May, FIA say the start of May. As it happens, they’ll probably both be wrong.

Shambolic few days for the pair of them.


Looks like the FIA have amended theirs to agree on end of May. Guessing someone at FIA didn't want to suggest Monaco might be cancelled too - *Cough*Won't someone please think of the money*Cough*


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:47 pm 
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A_Game_A_Day wrote:
JN23 wrote:
FIA and F1 still can’t agree in their statements. F1 say the season will start at the end of May, FIA say the start of May. As it happens, they’ll probably both be wrong.

Shambolic few days for the pair of them.


Looks like the FIA have amended theirs to agree on end of May. Guessing someone at FIA didn't want to suggest Monaco might be cancelled too - *Cough*Won't someone please think of the money*Cough*


Well I was kinda thinking the same thing but Zandvoort instead of Monaco as Zandvoort's in early May.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:32 pm 
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A_Game_A_Day wrote:
JN23 wrote:
FIA and F1 still can’t agree in their statements. F1 say the season will start at the end of May, FIA say the start of May. As it happens, they’ll probably both be wrong.

Shambolic few days for the pair of them.


Looks like the FIA have amended theirs to agree on end of May. Guessing someone at FIA didn't want to suggest Monaco might be cancelled too - *Cough*Won't someone please think of the money*Cough*


Monaco is the one they don't make money from.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 4:16 pm 
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Jezza13 wrote:
So a Chinese media outlet is 1 of 2 sources for this report carried by the Centre for Research on Globalisation.


Yes, but that's perhaps "them" and hence not believable by default, while independent.co.uk is perhaps "us" and hence the believable source by default... that can't actually either confirm it or debunk.
Anyway, what would be that hard evidence that covid-19 indeed originated in China and that it wasn't imported in in some way?
Therefore... who's to tell.
I guess, what I am trying to say, I won't be so eager to be a blank supporter of this already promoted and fueled idea of the Western powers ganging up on China now. FOX and some US officials are already in full swing, gladly siding with Trump to allocate the blame, insisting that covid-19 be called "Chinese coronavirus" or "Wuhan coronavirus".
The propaganda war is on both sides, the trade/technology war only being paused for a moment...


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 5:41 pm 
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Vettel Fan wrote:


So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.




I note your user name, maybe you noticed who was one of the first two drivers to fly away from the virus ?

Are you going to change your user name ?

.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 5:58 pm 
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Greenman wrote:
Vettel Fan wrote:


So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.




I note your user name, maybe you noticed who was one of the first two drivers to fly away from the virus ?

Are you going to change your user name ?

.


He wasn't flying away from the virus :lol: . I assume he was returning home to Switzerland where there are many, many more cases.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:30 pm 
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Well at least common sense has prevailed. An utter disgrace from the FIA trying to prioritise their bank balance over a public health emergency, as if they've not made themselves look like enough of a shambles recently.

We're not really seeing much of a joined-up approach across the world in dealing with the outbreak, and every nation seems to have looked inward and focused on looking after themselves rather than working together. Here in the UK the government seems to have taken a different policy to most; delaying the spread rather than trying to isolate and stop it entirely. The thinking seems to be to isolate the vulnerable, slow down the spread to ensure that the health service is not overburdened so that the vulnerable people who do catch it can get the treatment they need, and otherwise allow it to spread around the general population in a controlled manner to create a "herd immunity". This is a new strain of virus that we have no immunity to currently and now that it exists it is not going to disappear, you can't kill it off by isolating it and even if we do stop this current outbreak it'll just come back again like seasonal flu and cold viruses do. Personally I believe the UK government has got this spot on, but without other countries taking the same approach I'm concerned we could end up with a global split between countries where the population has immunity to the virus and those where they don't because they went for the "lockdown and isolate" policy.

Let's not forget that this herd immunity approach is how we eradicated smallpox (although they did so with a vaccine); for now this new virus seems harmless enough to a healthy person that we can achieve the same outcome without one. At least that's what the UK government has decided, I hope they're right!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51865915


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:14 pm 
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Zazu wrote:
Vettel Fan wrote:
So dumb. They're making a big deal over nothing.



More people are going to die due to the economic impact than the virus itself.
(World in general not just economic impact of F1)


We will only know in hindsight, but looking at the economic damage (not F1 related) that is now caused around the world, it is entirely possible.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:18 pm 
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A_Game_A_Day wrote:
[
*Cough*Won't someone please think of the money*Cough*


You might want to get that checked out....

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 11:38 am 
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j man wrote:
Here in the UK the government seems to have taken a different policy to most; delaying the spread rather than trying to isolate and stop it entirely. The thinking seems to be to isolate the vulnerable, slow down the spread to ensure that the health service is not overburdened so that the vulnerable people who do catch it can get the treatment they need, and otherwise allow it to spread around the general population in a controlled manner to create a "herd immunity". This is a new strain of virus that we have no immunity to currently and now that it exists it is not going to disappear, you can't kill it off by isolating it and even if we do stop this current outbreak it'll just come back again like seasonal flu and cold viruses do. Personally I believe the UK government has got this spot on, but without other countries taking the same approach I'm concerned we could end up with a global split between countries where the population has immunity to the virus and those where they don't because they went for the "lockdown and isolate" policy.

Let's not forget that this herd immunity approach is how we eradicated smallpox (although they did so with a vaccine); for now this new virus seems harmless enough to a healthy person that we can achieve the same outcome without one. At least that's what the UK government has decided, I hope they're right!



The problem with the herd immunity approach is that we start from almost zero as this is a new disease. Smallpox had been around for centuries. It will take several years of repeated epidemics - maybe on smaller scales, for immunity to build up. Doubtless a % of the population are immune already, but that won't stop the rest catching the disease because it's so contagious.

I think that the only effective govt approach is the Chinese one of total lockdown and sealing people in their homes. Banning mass gatherings or sporting events will help, but if you can catch it going to the pub or the shops the spread will go on. We in the democratic countries are not going to be able to stop coronavirus in my opinion. Even attempts to flatten the peak will have very little effect.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 12:48 pm 
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tim3003 wrote:
j man wrote:
Here in the UK the government seems to have taken a different policy to most; delaying the spread rather than trying to isolate and stop it entirely. The thinking seems to be to isolate the vulnerable, slow down the spread to ensure that the health service is not overburdened so that the vulnerable people who do catch it can get the treatment they need, and otherwise allow it to spread around the general population in a controlled manner to create a "herd immunity". This is a new strain of virus that we have no immunity to currently and now that it exists it is not going to disappear, you can't kill it off by isolating it and even if we do stop this current outbreak it'll just come back again like seasonal flu and cold viruses do. Personally I believe the UK government has got this spot on, but without other countries taking the same approach I'm concerned we could end up with a global split between countries where the population has immunity to the virus and those where they don't because they went for the "lockdown and isolate" policy.

Let's not forget that this herd immunity approach is how we eradicated smallpox (although they did so with a vaccine); for now this new virus seems harmless enough to a healthy person that we can achieve the same outcome without one. At least that's what the UK government has decided, I hope they're right!



The problem with the herd immunity approach is that we start from almost zero as this is a new disease. Smallpox had been around for centuries. It will take several years of repeated epidemics - maybe on smaller scales, for immunity to build up. Doubtless a % of the population are immune already, but that won't stop the rest catching the disease because it's so contagious.

I think that the only effective govt approach is the Chinese one of total lockdown and sealing people in their homes. Banning mass gatherings or sporting events will help, but if you can catch it going to the pub or the shops the spread will go on. We in the democratic countries are not going to be able to stop coronavirus in my opinion. Even attempts to flatten the peak will have very little effect.

The UK approach is strange on several levels.

First it is contrary to the rest of the world which is very much going down the preventative route, including comparable economies such as in Europe and even the US (at a state level at least).

Second, herd immunity usually refers to a virus for which there is vaccine - such as small pox. Also the threshold is usually around 85%, although it can be as low as 75%. The 60% figure quoted is much lower than either of those. Scientific papers regarding herd immunity again study it from the perspective of one where there is vaccine. Once you hit the threshold for a population being vaccinated then it protects the herds from an outbreak among the non vaccinated.

The idea of cultivating a vaccine through the population developing a resistance from zero is unprecedented as a course of action and the implications are unknown. Another very important factor is that it is presently unknown if a long term resistance will be built up over time as the preliminary data coming out of China suggests that 15% of people who got better went on to get reinfected before the lockdown. Consequentially it is one hell of a gamble for the government to take when so little is known about the virus.

Thirdly, the lockdown approach has been proven to work. Wuhan has a population of 11 million, roughly the same as London. Hubei province (where Wuhan is located) has a population of 58 million, roughly the same as the UK, and the areas are similar too (185,000 km2 vs 240,000 km2)

Wuhan now has the epidemic under control there, with less than 0.1 million people infected. Johnson's strategy is to get 40 million people infected - 400 times higher than in China.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:08 pm 
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"Herd immunity" in the UK's meaning is NOT to do with vaccination, but a large proportion of the population getting the mild version of the disease over an elongated period (meaning that the health service can manage the more serious cases). The problem with "shut down" is that when the restrictions are lifted infectious people MAY travel to infection free areas.

I am NOT an expert so cannot say which is right / wrong / better / worse.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 1:37 pm 
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Greenman wrote:
"Herd immunity" in the UK's meaning is NOT to do with vaccination, but a large proportion of the population getting the mild version of the disease over an elongated period (meaning that the health service can manage the more serious cases). The problem with "shut down" is that when the restrictions are lifted infectious people MAY travel to infection free areas.

I am NOT an expert so cannot say which is right / wrong / better / worse.

Vaccinations are created from a mild form of the disease. How can it be controlled how severe the level of disease someone catches? It's unlikely there are multiple strengths of the virus out there and even if there was there is no guarantee if you got the weak one that stops you from catching the strong one. It's normally the case that the severity of the virus depends on your immune response to it, which is consistent with what we have seen. The old and vulnerable have seen much higher death rates.

If that's the government's actual strategy then it is definitely better to try and limit the number of people catching it. The only thing that this course of action would ensure is that a load of people caught the virus!

It seems they are rolling the dice at a high states casino when it's proven there are far more effective strategies at play. Both China and Korea have demonstrated how to quickly get a severe outbreak under control (and Korea was basically dealt the nightmare situation of having had one of the very early cases travel up and down the country, and infect nearly 2,000 other people before being diagnosed) - it isn't the stock market, it isn't Brexit. This isn't something that can be thwarted by nationalistic spirit or outwitted by cunning ingenuity.

It should be noted that there is much opposition to the UK response from within the UK and from Johnson's own side - including the former Minister of Health, Jeremy Hunt, and George Osbourne's paper, the Standard, is reporting the WHO has cast doubt on the viability of such a strategy.


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