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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:15 am 
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What a spectacle it was again!
Mexico seems to deliver great battles in qualifying and hopefully some good racing again on Sunday.

In all fairness to Max, they drive at insane speeds and that yellow flag was not really the best visible flag. From what I've read the flag was not shown on screen.

However, when it comes to safety yes the drivers should respond to calls so I can inderstand the frustration here. It also doesn't help when Max gives these answers in the press but knowing how he say's it, it is indeed sarcasm
It might not come across that well in English.

Max is also a very straightforward guy. If you ask him something you get a answer. I am positive that Hamilton or Vettel would not have said anything like this in the press even if they were him. Maybe they would talk how important safety is etc. and the stewards would never looked again at the data and the pole stood solid.
That is one thing Max can learn. That a team is behind him and his actions and that sometimes being too honest is not the best thing too do. On the other hand, this is also why fans like him and dislike him. Staying true to yourself is very important in a sport and son't forget he has had all the critisism one can get. This is also the mindset that he will go for the win tomorrow and make it interesting foe the fans because starting from pole and finishing the race like that is maybe a bit too easy ;)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:37 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
F1 MERCENARY wrote:
Invade wrote:
Red Bull will NOT be happy with Verstappen behind closed doors - you can believe that.

I bet they’re actually being supportive on this one as they should. His response was matter of fact in saying they can strike his last lap as he already had pole, and his previous lap was set legally. Drivers blatantly go off tack with all 4 tires and they don’t always receive penalties and those lap times aren’t always stricken.

While true, this infraction was regarding safety, they don't play with that. Not the same thing really


Again. No Bottas penalty at Monza for exactly the same infraction. They clearly do play with that.

Bottas was right on the line in italy before the flags were out - or that he could see them. He didn't really get a chance to see them before he crossed it. According to what was said too, the team had not made him aware of the situation and he had not past any flags. If the team doesn't let you know, in this situation, you seem to get away with it from some articles postd at the time. You seem to often compare situations that you call exact that are pretty different. Like vettel's start compared to kimi's in russia.

This time out cmparing Bottas in italy to Verstappen here, Kimi was right off track nowhere near the racing line and there was no debris on track. Bottas was pretty much still on track when he crashed. And Verstappen went right past him full speed.

I can see an obvious difference again why Verstappen was punished here and Bottas wasn't in Italy.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:49 am 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
F1 MERCENARY wrote:
Invade wrote:
Red Bull will NOT be happy with Verstappen behind closed doors - you can believe that.

I bet they’re actually being supportive on this one as they should. His response was matter of fact in saying they can strike his last lap as he already had pole, and his previous lap was set legally. Drivers blatantly go off tack with all 4 tires and they don’t always receive penalties and those lap times aren’t always stricken.

While true, this infraction was regarding safety, they don't play with that. Not the same thing really


Again. No Bottas penalty at Monza for exactly the same infraction. They clearly do play with that.

Bottas was right on the line in italy before the flags were out - or that he could see them. He didn't really get a chance to see them before he crossed it. According to what was said too, the team had not made him aware of the situation and he had not past any flags. If the team doesn't let you know, in this situation, you seem to get away with it from some articles postd at the time. You seem to often compare situations that you call exact that are pretty different. Like vettel's start compared to kimi's in russia.

This time out cmparing Bottas in italy to Verstappen here, Kimi was right off track nowhere near the racing line and there was no debris on track. Bottas was pretty much still on track when he crashed. And Verstappen went right past him full speed.

I can see an obvious difference again why Verstappen was punished here and Bottas wasn't in Italy.


No. None of this is true Hogweed. Bottas went past the scene of the accident at full.speed with the yellow flags already out at that point.

You're thinking of the red flag which came out just as he crossed the line.


So both drivers went past and accident st full speed. Yellow flags were out both times. Both drivers set purple sectors.

Seems similar enough to me.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:09 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
F1 MERCENARY wrote:
I bet they’re actually being supportive on this one as they should. His response was matter of fact in saying they can strike his last lap as he already had pole, and his previous lap was set legally. Drivers blatantly go off tack with all 4 tires and they don’t always receive penalties and those lap times aren’t always stricken.

While true, this infraction was regarding safety, they don't play with that. Not the same thing really


Again. No Bottas penalty at Monza for exactly the same infraction. They clearly do play with that.

Bottas was right on the line in italy before the flags were out - or that he could see them. He didn't really get a chance to see them before he crossed it. According to what was said too, the team had not made him aware of the situation and he had not past any flags. If the team doesn't let you know, in this situation, you seem to get away with it from some articles postd at the time. You seem to often compare situations that you call exact that are pretty different. Like vettel's start compared to kimi's in russia.

This time out cmparing Bottas in italy to Verstappen here, Kimi was right off track nowhere near the racing line and there was no debris on track. Bottas was pretty much still on track when he crashed. And Verstappen went right past him full speed.

I can see an obvious difference again why Verstappen was punished here and Bottas wasn't in Italy.


No. None of this is true Hogweed. Bottas went past the scene of the accident at full.speed with the yellow flags already out at that point.

You're thinking of the red flag which came out just as he crossed the line.


So both drivers went past and accident st full speed. Yellow flags were out both times. Both drivers set purple sectors.

Seems similar enough to me.



When i watch the official f1 highlights of qualifying in italy, Hamilton's onboard shows no yellow flags (at least visible from his car) even when he had entered the straight to the finish line. I thought Bottas was said to have actually slowed down slightly despite his fast time.

Hamilton saw it happen, bottas might not have as he was a bit further back and they seemed pretty slow at getting the flags out. I blame them for that, but if bottas had none in his line of sight and the team did not tell him, that is why he will have got away with it. As it is up to the team to let the drivers know aswell. I can't remember where it was in the thread now, but there were reasons given why Bottas got away with it and it was related to the fact the team hadn't told him. And it is related to this why drivers smetimes can get away with this. That seems strange admittedly, but it wasn't obvious that he could have seen yellows from his car. If he did, then i am certain he will have been punished.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:21 am 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
While true, this infraction was regarding safety, they don't play with that. Not the same thing really


Again. No Bottas penalty at Monza for exactly the same infraction. They clearly do play with that.

Bottas was right on the line in italy before the flags were out - or that he could see them. He didn't really get a chance to see them before he crossed it. According to what was said too, the team had not made him aware of the situation and he had not past any flags. If the team doesn't let you know, in this situation, you seem to get away with it from some articles postd at the time. You seem to often compare situations that you call exact that are pretty different. Like vettel's start compared to kimi's in russia.

This time out cmparing Bottas in italy to Verstappen here, Kimi was right off track nowhere near the racing line and there was no debris on track. Bottas was pretty much still on track when he crashed. And Verstappen went right past him full speed.

I can see an obvious difference again why Verstappen was punished here and Bottas wasn't in Italy.


No. None of this is true Hogweed. Bottas went past the scene of the accident at full.speed with the yellow flags already out at that point.

You're thinking of the red flag which came out just as he crossed the line.


So both drivers went past and accident st full speed. Yellow flags were out both times. Both drivers set purple sectors.

Seems similar enough to me.


You seem
When i watch the official f1 highlights of qualifying in italy, Hamilton's onboard shows no yellow flags (at least visible from his car) even when he had entered the straight to the finish line. I thought Bottas was said to have actually slowed down slightly despite his fast time.


No Hamilton wouldn't have seen yellow flags because the accident happened literally right in front of him. Bottas was running behind Hamilton on track and did have the yellow flags through The Parobolica.

Obviously there weren't yellow flags on the start finish straight. Why would there be? That was after the accident. and beyond the stretch of track yellows would be shown for.

Bottas' actions and Verstappen's were near identical. Both set purple sectors whilst ignoring yellow flags.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:45 am 
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d_dingbat wrote:
Glad to see Bottas okay. The way he was breathing had me a bit worried if he broke his ribs or something.

While commentating they never finished the line - Avoid sneezing while braking in a F1 car because...?



You end up with snot all over the inside of your visor


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:47 am 
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They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:10 am 
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FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:23 am 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Good call from the stewards. They had to set a firm precedent. Verstappen's press conference was so arrogant just dismissively saying that they can delete the Lap if they wanted as his previous lap was good enough.


Part of me wonders whether that triggered the FIA to act. It seemed earlier that there was going to be no action.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:31 am 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:43 am 
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FormulaFun wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is

I'm maybe the issue as i see the reason why bottas maybe didn't get one. And although most disagreed with this, there were reasons given as to why he didn't get one. He apparently lifted off by 2 tenths and Bottas was only informed by the team about the red flag by the time he crossed the line. As odd as it seems, from the information given, Bottas wasn't in the wrong.

Loads of drivers got reprimands, or other penalties so i doubt they will have skipped Bottas out. They will have had reasons that maybe we don't know about. Too many people who comment on f1 related stuff act like they are in charge of the panalties in a way. They can see more than us and have more evidence than we will ever get. So I'd still say Bottas will have had enough of a reason not to even get investigated. They can't just forget...

we discussed it here and on several other pages too:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=15672&start=160


Last edited by TheGiantHogweed on Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:48 am 
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FormulaFun wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is


Yeah, maybe I'm getting unduly annoyed.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:08 am 
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Pest44 wrote:
Clarky wrote:
Pest44 wrote:
I don’t think there was actually a yellow flag after Bottas crashed. Which is again poor from Masi

Yes there was.

I was writing this when it was live at the time and there wasn’t any yellows shown on the track side boards or on the main feed until after the session had finished. Which made you think there wasn’t any yellows. It’s only after the watching the reply’s that you see a marshal wave a yellow. I don’t understand why it wasn’t an instant red flag as that seems to be the protocol now when someone crashes in qualifying

I can only assume the G meter wasn't triggered.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:12 am 
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Food for thought.

3 place grid penalty to a safety infringement.
5 place grid penalty for a gearbox change.

Bit backwards if you ask me.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:20 am 
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Clarky wrote:
Food for thought.

3 place grid penalty to a safety infringement.
5 place grid penalty for a gearbox change.

Bit backwards if you ask me.


Agreed. Not hugely important in the grand scheme of things but the penalty system is probably something that F1 could do with sorting out


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:27 am 
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"I think we all know what a yellow flag means," Verstappen said. Pressed on why he did not slow, given the safety concerns, he said: "Do we have to go there? To safety? I think we know what we are doing - otherwise we would not be driving an F1 car. It's qualifying and, yeah, you go for it. But like I said before, if they want to delete the lap, then delete the lap."

If I am inferring correctly, Max doesn't seem to think that drivers should always have to lift because they know what they're doing. Assuming I am correct with my inference, that's a truly disgusting thing to have said.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:57 am 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
"I think we all know what a yellow flag means," Verstappen said. Pressed on why he did not slow, given the safety concerns, he said: "Do we have to go there? To safety? I think we know what we are doing - otherwise we would not be driving an F1 car. It's qualifying and, yeah, you go for it. But like I said before, if they want to delete the lap, then delete the lap."

If I am inferring correctly, Max doesn't seem to think that drivers should always have to lift because they know what they're doing. Assuming I am correct with my inference, that's a truly disgusting thing to have said.


Just about all of them think it. The others are just bright enough not to say it.

I remember as far back as Hakkinen going flat out past yellows but waving to acknowledge that he'd seen them.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:08 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:
Food for thought.

3 place grid penalty to a safety infringement.
5 place grid penalty for a gearbox change.

Bit backwards if you ask me.


Agreed. Not hugely important in the grand scheme of things but the penalty system is probably something that F1 could do with sorting out

Very good point. Totally agree.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:23 pm 
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froze wrote:
If I remember correctly, I think Bottas set a purple sector on S2 before he crashed on S3. Does anyone know what all of their times were after S2?

Both Hamilton and Bottas were a tenth down to Verstappen's provisional pole lap after S2, they both looked set to challenge Leclercs lap maybe even Verstappens, Hamilton lost 2 to 3 tenths in S3 presumable because of Bottas' crash?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:28 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.

Not really, once Verstappen admitted what he had done then how could the stewards react any differently, if not for that then the stewards had already decided that Verstappen had backed off enough.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:29 pm 
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-K- wrote:
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Good call from the stewards. They had to set a firm precedent. Verstappen's press conference was so arrogant just dismissively saying that they can delete the Lap if they wanted as his previous lap was good enough.


Part of me wonders whether that triggered the FIA to act. It seemed earlier that there was going to be no action.

That's exactly why he got penalised.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:30 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is


Yeah, maybe I'm getting unduly annoyed.

Perhaps Verstappen is the one you should be annoyed with, he self penalised himself.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:33 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:
Food for thought.

3 place grid penalty to a safety infringement.
5 place grid penalty for a gearbox change.

Bit backwards if you ask me.


Agreed. Not hugely important in the grand scheme of things but the penalty system is probably something that F1 could do with sorting out

I'd also like a system were drivers lose laps for ruining other drivers laps by fetching out either yellow or red flags, it would also self police any kind of cheating like looking to protect a pole position, in this instance Bottas would be starting 10th.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:34 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
"I think we all know what a yellow flag means," Verstappen said. Pressed on why he did not slow, given the safety concerns, he said: "Do we have to go there? To safety? I think we know what we are doing - otherwise we would not be driving an F1 car. It's qualifying and, yeah, you go for it. But like I said before, if they want to delete the lap, then delete the lap."

If I am inferring correctly, Max doesn't seem to think that drivers should always have to lift because they know what they're doing. Assuming I am correct with my inference, that's a truly disgusting thing to have said.


Just about all of them think it. The others are just bright enough not to say it.

I remember as far back as Hakkinen going flat out past yellows but waving to acknowledge that he'd seen them.

Vettel clearly slowed down for the yellow flags.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:35 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
They obviously aren't exactly the same incidents as in Monza there is significant run off where as in Mexico that section is basically a street circuit and Bottas is basically still on the track with stewards coming out to support him, and debris on the track

But whatever the differences, the penalty is obviously deserved and the fact that bottas didn't get one is the mistake, of which the stewards made many in Monza. So your idea is that they should make the wrong decision again for consistency. Two wrongs don't make a right

What disgusts me more is his attitude towards his actions afterwards in the press. Such an affront to the rules and safety of the other drivers and stewards who are volunteering - "slow and prepare to stop" and he keeps his foot down flat then brags about it after. The guy is straight up thick as pig excrement and a tell tale sign of his upbringing.


No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is


Yeah, maybe I'm getting unduly annoyed.

Perhaps Verstappen is the one you should be annoyed with, he self penalised himself.


His penalty doesn't annoy me. I'm not a Verstappen fan. I just don't feel he deserves a lot of the crirscm he gets. There are things that a lot of drivers do that only Verstapppen gets picked up on.

I am annoyed about any driver ignoring yellow flags though. I've seen the sport compromised so heavily in the name of safety for these guys the least they could do is follow rules put in place for their safety that they've known about since karting.


Last edited by mikeyg123 on Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:54 pm 
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Lance Stroll just isn't very good is he? I reckon in equal equipment Kubica is the only driver he'd be able to outqualify with any regularity.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:55 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
No, I'm being consistent. I think both should be penalties.

The stewards have made the correct call here. I'm just frustrated reading all the golden boy stuff when in this case I can actually demonstrate how untrue that is.

At least that will have to stop now.


Everybody is being consistent, fairly sure general consensus is that bottas should have had a penalty too, so don't know what your issue is


Yeah, maybe I'm getting unduly annoyed.

Perhaps Verstappen is the one you should be annoyed with, he self penalised himself.


His penalty doesn't annoy me. I'm not a Verstappen fan. I just don't feel he deserves a lot of the crirscm he gets. There are things that a lot of drivers do that only Verstapppen gets picked up on.

I am annoyed about My driver ignoring yellow flags though. I've seen the sport compromised so heavily in the name of safety for these guys the least they could do is follow rules put in place for their safety that they've known about since karting.

In this case though which other drivers also failed to observe the yellow flags?

I feel disappointed for Verstappen, in terms of who was fastest he deserved to be on pole, silly thing for him to say rather than do because yet again the stewards were somewhat clueless to what had happened.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:57 pm 
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BMWSauber84 wrote:
Lance Stroll just isn't very good is he? I reckon in equal equipment Kubica is the only driver he'd be able to outqualify with any regularity.

Yep the second worse qualifier on the grid.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 1:11 pm 
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Blathering Buxton strikes again.
Quote:
Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

Verstappen loses pole, picks up a 3 place penalty and will start P4. Leclerc inherits pole on an all Ferrari front row.

Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

I adore Max but my God he can be frustrating. That first lap was astonishing. He had P1 by rights. As soon as VB crashed nobody could improve. His belligerence in not lifting and then defending his actions have cost him and show despite his maturity this year, there’s a way to go


Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

All that said, there is a rawness to him and an honesty that’s almost admirable in a way. His actions today were dangerous and unnecessary. His arrogance in the face of his fault was foolish. But would you want him any other way?


Yes Will I would have it otherwise. Max needs to grow up!!!

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 1:54 pm 
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You could hope Verstappen Junior inherited from his mother some additionnal neurons to complete the low stock he could get from his father... It obviously failed.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 2:15 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Not really, once Verstappen admitted what he had done then how could the stewards react any differently, if not for that then the stewards had already decided that Verstappen had backed off enough.

I have to agree, Max's comments left the stewards little choice but to revisit the incident.
:nod:

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 2:28 pm 
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Mort Canard wrote:
Blathering Buxton strikes again.
Quote:
Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

Verstappen loses pole, picks up a 3 place penalty and will start P4. Leclerc inherits pole on an all Ferrari front row.

Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

I adore Max but my God he can be frustrating. That first lap was astonishing. He had P1 by rights. As soon as VB crashed nobody could improve. His belligerence in not lifting and then defending his actions have cost him and show despite his maturity this year, there’s a way to go


Will Buxton
‏Verified account @wbuxtonofficial

All that said, there is a rawness to him and an honesty that’s almost admirable in a way. His actions today were dangerous and unnecessary. His arrogance in the face of his fault was foolish. But would you want him any other way?


Yes Will I would have it otherwise. Max needs to grow up!!!

Honestly, with the improved way that Max has carried himself throughout most of this year, I am a little disappointed by his foolishness from yesterday. Shot himself in the foot there. Oh well. The race is today and he still has a good shot at the win.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:36 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Honestly, with the improved way that Max has carried himself throughout most of this year, I am a little disappointed by his foolishness from yesterday. Shot himself in the foot there. Oh well. The race is today and he still has a good shot at the win.

.

Actually, I am more concerned by the foolishness (indeed "shooting" in their feet") of the stewards !

They completely ignore the rules until Max makes it impossible for them - it is about time that the FIA upped the quality of the stewards.

.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:37 pm 
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Greenman wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Honestly, with the improved way that Max has carried himself throughout most of this year, I am a little disappointed by his foolishness from yesterday. Shot himself in the foot there. Oh well. The race is today and he still has a good shot at the win.

.

Actually, I am more concerned by the foolishness (indeed "shooting" in their feet") of the stewards !

They completely ignore the rules until Max makes it impossible for them - it is about time that the FIA upped the quality of the stewards.

.


Its weird. Like they've become terrified of doing any actual stewarding.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:46 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Greenman wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Honestly, with the improved way that Max has carried himself throughout most of this year, I am a little disappointed by his foolishness from yesterday. Shot himself in the foot there. Oh well. The race is today and he still has a good shot at the win.

.

Actually, I am more concerned by the foolishness (indeed "shooting" in their feet") of the stewards !

They completely ignore the rules until Max makes it impossible for them - it is about time that the FIA upped the quality of the stewards.

.


Its weird. Like they've become terrified of doing any actual stewarding.

They have. Stewards used to be able to expect near anonymity. The stewards from the Canadian GP were attacked mercilessly online by thousands of people. They had famous drivers like Sebastian Vettel and Mario Andretti calling them out and blaming them for all of F1's problems. Who the hell wants to deal with that? Stewarding is a pretty thankless job to begin with and now, in the era of crybabies, it has also become hostile.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 3:47 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Greenman wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Honestly, with the improved way that Max has carried himself throughout most of this year, I am a little disappointed by his foolishness from yesterday. Shot himself in the foot there. Oh well. The race is today and he still has a good shot at the win.

.

Actually, I am more concerned by the foolishness (indeed "shooting" in their feet") of the stewards !

They completely ignore the rules until Max makes it impossible for them - it is about time that the FIA upped the quality of the stewards.

.


Its weird. Like they've become terrified of doing any actual stewarding.


You do wonder if there is some sort of instruction to only address the blatantly obvious infractions don't you..


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:13 pm 
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So Hamilton couldn't have cared less that his teammate crashed heavily right in front of him. Well I guess they weren't fast enough with the flags but in such obvious situations you shouldn't wait for the flags IMO.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:29 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
So Hamilton couldn't have cared less that his teammate crashed heavily right in front of him. Well I guess they weren't fast enough with the flags but in such obvious situations you shouldn't wait for the flags IMO.


In fairness if you actually witness the accident and can see a very clear and safe path through it's dangerous to keep going. It's not like coming across an accident and not knowing the full picture.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:35 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Covalent wrote:
So Hamilton couldn't have cared less that his teammate crashed heavily right in front of him. Well I guess they weren't fast enough with the flags but in such obvious situations you shouldn't wait for the flags IMO.


In fairness if you actually witness the accident and can see a very clear and safe path through it's dangerous to keep going. It's not like coming across an accident and not knowing the full picture.


How did he know there was a 100% safe passageway through?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:47 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Covalent wrote:
So Hamilton couldn't have cared less that his teammate crashed heavily right in front of him. Well I guess they weren't fast enough with the flags but in such obvious situations you shouldn't wait for the flags IMO.


In fairness if you actually witness the accident and can see a very clear and safe path through it's dangerous to keep going. It's not like coming across an accident and not knowing the full picture.


How did he know there was a 100% safe passageway through?


I was under the impression he saw the accident?

Now we don't have marshals on a live circuit the main reason it's important for drivers to adhere to yellow flags is that they may need to stop if something's blocking the track. If you actually see the accident happen you know the track isn't blocked.


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