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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:01 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I can't remember the last time Brundle and Crofty were so bad at commentating in the race. I hope Sky get a better line up next year!! They both made countless mistakes.


The amount of times they seemed convinced (Ted too) that Raikkonen was going to come out ahead of Hamilton despite not being far enough ahead :thumbdown:


Maybe Ferrari left it too long?


I thought they were saying when he was roughly 16s ahead, isn't it 18/19s for a pit stop?


What I mean is maybe the pitstop window was only there on a lap of two but the RBs and Hamilton started to reduce the gap and it was too late, I'm only guessing though, lap times would say more.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:01 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
Ferrari should also be leading in the WCC but they are a one car team unfortunately. At this stage, Kimi being on the team is a joke. Before pitting, he was 20 seconds behind Vettel on the same tires after the first stint. That's just too much of a deficit. Honestly, Ferrari should be looking to replace him urgently. He's too slow.
Bertrand Gachot, co-commentating for RTBF this evening, was astonished why Ferrari kept him out so long. I would have to listen to that bit again, but the impression he gave was that Ferrari are only looking out for one driver. And it's not Räikkönen. Which is a pity for him, but doesn't reflect his true capability.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:03 pm 
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Flash2k11 wrote:
lucifers wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
One of the more genuinely boring races this season, especially after qualy promised so much. As I said earlier, Mercedes had better hope this delayed engine has the beans; right now Vettel looks half a street ahead.

In the wider picture, getting sick to death of all the front runners driving well within themselves to conserve tyres for the ultimate fear of having to make another stop.



was hoping Mercedes or redbull would have thrown caution to the wind and make a second stop


Kimi was wide open for this strategy, and if Danny Ric can go fastest of all on the last lap having been utterly mediocre pacewise prior, someone on fresh rubber with nothing to lose would surely have gone seriously quicker. Feels like all the top 3 teams are locked into safety first thinking because the midfield isn't close enough to push them on.


If you can't overtake on the same tyres at China or Montreal I'm not sure where else you can.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:03 pm 
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Merc were clearly conserving the engine.... Ferrari really didn’t have much engine advantage as they should of had. Kimi was well Kimi smh being that he was in the best position to have a great race and did nothing with it. Would love to see Redbull with just a bit more power

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:04 pm 
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gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Last edited by blhsing on Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:05 pm 
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Oasis wrote:
Bernie's sprinkler system doesnt seem like such a bad idea anymore



we need rain on sunday if this is what we have to look forward too


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:06 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Ferrari should also be leading in the WCC but they are a one car team unfortunately. At this stage, Kimi being on the team is a joke. Before pitting, he was 20 seconds behind Vettel on the same tires after the first stint. That's just too much of a deficit. Honestly, Ferrari should be looking to replace him urgently. He's too slow.
Bertrand Gachot, co-commentating for RTBF this evening, was astonished why Ferrari kept him out so long. I would have to listen to that bit again, but the impression he gave was that Ferrari are only looking out for one driver. And it's not Räikkönen. Which is a pity for him, but doesn't reflect his true capability.


Nope, this was all down to Kimi not being on pace during the race. Ferrari gave him one chance he had to jump Hamilton, and that was in pits. He didnt do enough even in clean air for as long as it was needed. Had they brought him in, it would have made no difference. He never showed any pace on fresh tyres after 1 or 2 quick laps immediately after the pit stop.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:07 pm 
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Well that was a horribly boring race. Hamilton impressive to challenge Ricciardo with a gone engine.

The Mercedes is a dog.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:07 pm 
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Don’t understand why no one tried a 2 stopper. I thought for sure that would have been the preferred strategy. But it looked like everyone opted to follow Pirellis advice. Result: one of the most boring races so far this year. Really looking forward to next years aero changes. We can not go on like this.

Ferrari has the best car. It isn’t much better but it’s better. Spain was solely due to them not figuring out the “shaved” tires. So Merc is in trouble. I don’t think their engine upgrade is going to make a lot of difference. There wasn’t much difference with Merc and Ferrari trap speeds this weekend. I think it’s more about the chassis. Ferrari has the better one.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:09 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:10 pm 
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gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.
Yes, engine power declines with age.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:10 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I can't remember the last time Brundle and Crofty were so bad at commentating in the race. I hope Sky get a better line up next year!! They both made countless mistakes.

They kept suggesting that Ferrari had nothing to loose with Kimi and could have tried a 2nd stop for him.... a "bright" idea that never took into consideration the fact that in all likeliness, with nothing more to gain, Mercedes would have 2nd stopped Hamilton too on the following lap, negating even that 17laps fresher tires that Kimi had over Hamilton throughout the 2nd stint.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:12 pm 
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gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.


Yes, less power and having to run a more conservative tune to keep optimal peak power lower so the engine doesn’t go boom

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Last edited by Mayhem on Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:13 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.
Yes, engine power declines with age.


Ted Kravitz said Mercedes confirmed by 0.050.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:15 pm 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.
Yes, engine power declines with age.


Ted Kravitz said Mercedes confirmed by 0.050.
What does 0.050 refer to?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:16 pm 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.
Yes, engine power declines with age.


Ted Kravitz said Mercedes confirmed by 0.050.


Which is a very minimal amount.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:17 pm 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
lucifers wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
One of the more genuinely boring races this season, especially after qualy promised so much. As I said earlier, Mercedes had better hope this delayed engine has the beans; right now Vettel looks half a street ahead.

In the wider picture, getting sick to death of all the front runners driving well within themselves to conserve tyres for the ultimate fear of having to make another stop.



was hoping Mercedes or redbull would have thrown caution to the wind and make a second stop


Kimi was wide open for this strategy, and if Danny Ric can go fastest of all on the last lap having been utterly mediocre pacewise prior, someone on fresh rubber with nothing to lose would surely have gone seriously quicker. Feels like all the top 3 teams are locked into safety first thinking because the midfield isn't close enough to push them on.


If you can't overtake on the same tyres at China or Montreal I'm not sure where else you can.


hence why they should have pitted Hamilton a second time for ultras.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:19 pm 
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As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:22 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
blhsing wrote:

Ah - would this have meant reduced power? Still looks like the chassis has a narrow operating window. Certainly compared to Ferrari’s.
Yes, engine power declines with age.


Ted Kravitz said Mercedes confirmed by 0.050.
What does 0.050 refer to?


0.050seconds is the difference between a brand new engine and the one run this weekend.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:22 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:23 pm 
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lucifers wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
lucifers wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:
One of the more genuinely boring races this season, especially after qualy promised so much. As I said earlier, Mercedes had better hope this delayed engine has the beans; right now Vettel looks half a street ahead.

In the wider picture, getting sick to death of all the front runners driving well within themselves to conserve tyres for the ultimate fear of having to make another stop.



was hoping Mercedes or redbull would have thrown caution to the wind and make a second stop


Kimi was wide open for this strategy, and if Danny Ric can go fastest of all on the last lap having been utterly mediocre pacewise prior, someone on fresh rubber with nothing to lose would surely have gone seriously quicker. Feels like all the top 3 teams are locked into safety first thinking because the midfield isn't close enough to push them on.


If you can't overtake on the same tyres at China or Montreal I'm not sure where else you can.


hence why they should have pitted Hamilton a second time for ultras.


He would have finished 6th.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:24 pm 
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Bottas had to ease off towards the end as he was running out of fuel,so without the early safety car he would have run out!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:24 pm 
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As a spectacle and a source of entertainment, that Grand Prix was a shocker after Lap 1.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:24 pm 
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gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.

I don't think Mercedes will be too worried. A 7 race old engine will have some disadvantage to a brand new Renault engine with upgrades on the car. When both mercedes drivers get a new engine and their upgrade brings an improvement like Red Bull had, they will likely be well ahead again. I feel that is the way it will go.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:27 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.


Bottas has been solid, consistent and has run Hamilton close really all year. But Hamilton, even as great as he is, is known to have his dips in form. Last year was the one year he was strong virtually every weekend unti the championship was sewn up. This year he has been up and down. But usually when he’s on the back foot and losing out in the championship battle he responds in quite a big way. He is a driver that needs a shove in the back to get going. And when he gets going many say that he’s unbeatable. Let’s see what he does the remainder of the year.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:28 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.


I don't think Hamilton has been at his best this season. Just seems uninspired.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:30 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.

I didn't forget that. You ignored that I mentioned it... I am basically pointing out that Hamilton loosing out on a win there was about as unlucky as Bottas missing a win in China. (likely missing out on the same amount of points) And was why I think that they has similar bad luck at that stage. It isn't me forgetting things. it seems like you didn't read everything and seemed to think I had forgotten. Sorry to say.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:35 pm 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
lucifers wrote:

hence why they should have pitted Hamilton a second time for ultras.


He would have finished 6th.

Yup, None of the top 6 behind Vettel could gamble 2nd stop. Mainly because they had seen what Ferrari can do on old tyres. Nobody would have risked falling behind Kimi after seeing Vettel punch in fast laps on 30+ laps old tyre. Wouldnt have been possible to regain the lost time and position.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:35 pm 
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I know Merc were running the old engine but just have the feeling that something is not right with Hamilton. Bar a couple of races he has been pretty average and not signed new contract yet. Perhaps he isn't as motivated this year and his time maybe nigh. Would explain some performances


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:40 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.


I don't think Hamilton has been at his best this season. Just seems uninspired.
I definitely would not use "uninspiring" to describe Hamilton's first race of the season, where he absolutely dominated, qualifying 0.7s ahead of Raikkonen and Vettel, while Bottas crashed out, and in the race Hamilton was again in a class of his own and was comfortably ahead of Raikkkonen and Vettel until the VSC, when Vettel's delayed pitstop saved him at least 15 seconds and gave him the lead and the win.


Last edited by blhsing on Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:42 pm 
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TheGiantHogweed wrote:
blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.

I didn't forget that. You ignored that I mentioned it... I am basically pointing out that Hamilton loosing out on a win there was about as unlucky as Bottas missing a win in China. (likely missing out on the same amount of points) And was why I think that they has similar bad luck at that stage. It isn't me forgetting things. it seems like you didn't read everything and seemed to think I had forgotten. Sorry to say.
Oops I indeed missed that. Apologies for that.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:47 pm 
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F1_Ernie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
I can't remember the last time Brundle and Crofty were so bad at commentating in the race. I hope Sky get a better line up next year!! They both made countless mistakes.


The amount of times they seemed convinced (Ted too) that Raikkonen was going to come out ahead of Hamilton despite not being far enough ahead :thumbdown:


Maybe Ferrari left it too long?

I think they did. At one point he'd cleared Hamilton and looked like he might have had a chance at Ricciardo, but then over a couple of laps he lost quite a chunk of time and ended up losing to both. Two or three laps too many


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:50 pm 
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funkymonkey wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
lucifers wrote:

hence why they should have pitted Hamilton a second time for ultras.


He would have finished 6th.

Yup, None of the top 6 behind Vettel could gamble 2nd stop. Mainly because they had seen what Ferrari can do on old tyres. Nobody would have risked falling behind Kimi after seeing Vettel punch in fast laps on 30+ laps old tyre. Wouldnt have been possible to regain the lost time and position.


+ Bottas and Ricciardio said they were low on fuel, so they probably all were. So not enough fuel to go flat out and recover / gain position. They maybe banked on more safety cars that never came


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:58 pm 
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Unusually serene race with excellent result. Vettel is back in the fight. Bottas and Verstapen deservingly on the podium. Renault doing a good job, butt enough only to win in the F1 second league, Leclerc raising his stocks again. RBR a bit disappointing, since some thought that the track might suit them more. Hamilton had a one off, he will be back like usual. Kimi needs to have a decent finish of his carrier, hopefully this year, because imho one more year and he will lose more speed and be more embarassed.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 9:02 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
blhsing wrote:
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
As some people seem to be thinking, is Bottas having a great season, or is Hamilton not doing so well? The fact now is, if Bottas hadn't retired in Baku, he would be just 2 points behind Hamilton. Bottas 111, Hamilton 113. So If Bottas beat Hamilton next race by finishing 1st 2nd or even 3rd with Hamilton behind (which wouldn't be impossible) He would be ahead in the championship. And that would basically be in the middle of the season. And I don't know if their luck has been that different really if you ignore Baku. Hamilton did have a grid penalty but had a little luck with the retirements ahead. Bottas missed a well deserved win in China. Basically like Hamilton in Australia.

They have both had good and bad luck, but Bottas at this stage clearly a fair bit worse off.

But the fact is, if everyone is saying Hamilton is a top driver and gets the most from his car, is that true at the moment? Or is Bottas more than good enough to deserve this seat? I personally think Hamilton has been ok by his standards. Has been great in several, but poor in others. Bottas had a very bad weeknd start, but to me has not looked much worse than hamilton ever since then at all.

I think Bottas is looking better than he did at the start of last year by quite a bit actually. Hopefully he will keep it up.
If you want to talk about all the what-if's you surely have forgotten the sure-fire win Hamilton would've gotten in the first race if Mercedes did not throw it away during the safety car.

I didn't forget that. You ignored that I mentioned it... I am basically pointing out that Hamilton loosing out on a win there was about as unlucky as Bottas missing a win in China. (likely missing out on the same amount of points) And was why I think that they has similar bad luck at that stage. It isn't me forgetting things. it seems like you didn't read everything and seemed to think I had forgotten. Sorry to say.
Oops I indeed missed that. Apologies for that.

No problem :) I'm sometimes to quick with my comments and have not read through correctly.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 9:15 pm 
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Just another monaco only faster. This is not looking good for the rest of the schedule. Too many aero bits on these cars.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 9:48 pm 
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Christ. 3 DRS zones and i can barely remember there being any overtakes.

Lewis' girlfriend ballsing up the chequered flag was the highlight of an otherwise dull race.

It apparently wasn't her fault, but why was she even up there? What is Liberty's obsession with celebrity? If the race hadn't of been so dull they could have severely ruined the outcome by having to classify 2 laps previous.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:08 pm 
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That model had no idea what she was doing and the thing was worse that she just kept waving and waving like there is no tomorrow, even when the track was empty before her.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 11:05 pm 
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blhsing wrote:
gregs51 wrote:
Mercedes now in real danger of becoming third best car. Unless they find something soon Red Bull will have the upper hand at the more aero tracks. The Ferrari is untouchable now in Vettels hands. There always seems to be something wrong with the Merc setup - tyres, cooling, straight line speed, oversteer, understeer. There is something inherently divaish in the chassis that has been masked by engine superiority.
Don't think you knew that Mercedes was still on their first engine this race, which was due for replacement before the race but stayed on because of a quality issue with the new engine. They'll bounce right back with the new engine in the next race for sure.


Remember that Bottas got runner up so with the same PU plus the fact that Mercedes were the only of the top teams that was not running an upgrade. Despite that Ferrari do look quicker this year. These are very very small margins though with drivers playing a significant part this year or we would be seeing teams finishing in tandem.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 11:12 pm 
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Tassadar wrote:
SDLRob wrote:
Stroll lost grip and took Hartley into the barrier... one of those 'His fault, but no blame' incidents IMHO


Honestly, I'm with Brundle. Hartley was pushing his luck on the outside.


I would say there are a ton of passes that come from a driver pushing their luck.
Stroll had poor drive out of turn 4 and there was an opportunity for Hartley to grab a position. If stroll hadn’t gotten out of shape we possibly would have been talking about that pass being the only exciting thing from the race.


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