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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:26 pm 
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Herb Tarlik wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Herb Tarlik wrote:
ALESI wrote:
Must take some balls to post an 'apology' on Instagram....


Well said. He should apologize directly to those he offended.


How do you know he hasn't?


If you publicly castigate someone, the honorable thing to do is to publicly apologize. I dont know if he has done so in private but I would be my money on it that he has not.


Sorry Herb, I don't get you. First you want him to apologise directly to those he offended, then you say the right thing is to publicly apologise.

Kind of confusing!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:28 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it.

Agreed, that's what's been discussed here if you didn't get it.

mikeyg123 wrote:
People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


Ah, ok. So people can only discuss stuff if they are more serious than what others have done in the past?

Got you.


I didn't see any sensitive souls here and it certainly doesn't matter if Max is an ultra talent or a De Cesaris. Max said some things, then backtracked and lied about it. That's what was pointed out. I don't see any pitchforks and no one asked for blood. We can still chat about what drivers say and do, right?


Just noiceable that people want to chat and criticise Verstappen for things they wouldn't even bring up about other drivers.

De Cesaris had talent. His problem was he couldn't keep it applied to the track!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:39 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it.

Agreed, that's what's been discussed here if you didn't get it.

mikeyg123 wrote:
People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


Ah, ok. So people can only discuss stuff if they are more serious than what others have done in the past?

Got you.


I didn't see any sensitive souls here and it certainly doesn't matter if Max is an ultra talent or a De Cesaris. Max said some things, then backtracked and lied about it. That's what was pointed out. I don't see any pitchforks and no one asked for blood. We can still chat about what drivers say and do, right?


Just noiceable that people want to chat and criticise Verstappen for things they wouldn't even bring up about other drivers.

De Cesaris had talent. His problem was he couldn't keep it applied to the track!


Come on mikeyg123, you've been here long enough to know that this has happened before. The only other recent thread about swearing at authorities in public was Vettel's radio love message to Whiting last year. And that was discussed in the forum as well. Along with a poll of how Vettel should have been punished.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:32 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it.

Agreed, that's what's been discussed here if you didn't get it.

mikeyg123 wrote:
People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


Ah, ok. So people can only discuss stuff if they are more serious than what others have done in the past?

Got you.


I didn't see any sensitive souls here and it certainly doesn't matter if Max is an ultra talent or a De Cesaris. Max said some things, then backtracked and lied about it. That's what was pointed out. I don't see any pitchforks and no one asked for blood. We can still chat about what drivers say and do, right?


Just noiceable that people want to chat and criticise Verstappen for things they wouldn't even bring up about other drivers.

De Cesaris had talent. His problem was he couldn't keep it applied to the track!


Wow. That is just a ridiculous comment on your part. I really expect better from you. ANYONE that said what Max said would be talked about in the forum. You KNOW that. At least you should.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:33 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it.

Agreed, that's what's been discussed here if you didn't get it.

mikeyg123 wrote:
People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


Ah, ok. So people can only discuss stuff if they are more serious than what others have done in the past?

Got you.


I didn't see any sensitive souls here and it certainly doesn't matter if Max is an ultra talent or a De Cesaris. Max said some things, then backtracked and lied about it. That's what was pointed out. I don't see any pitchforks and no one asked for blood. We can still chat about what drivers say and do, right?


Just noiceable that people want to chat and criticise Verstappen for things they wouldn't even bring up about other drivers.

De Cesaris had talent. His problem was he couldn't keep it applied to the track!


Come on mikeyg123, you've been here long enough to know that this has happened before. The only other recent thread about swearing at authorities in public was Vettel's radio love message to Whiting last year. And that was discussed in the forum as well. Along with a poll of how Vettel should have been punished.


Are these he ony two times it's happened or the only two times it's inspired a thread?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:33 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:
Herb Tarlik wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Herb Tarlik wrote:
ALESI wrote:
Must take some balls to post an 'apology' on Instagram....


Well said. He should apologize directly to those he offended.


How do you know he hasn't?


If you publicly castigate someone, the honorable thing to do is to publicly apologize. I dont know if he has done so in private but I would be my money on it that he has not.


Sorry Herb, I don't get you. First you want him to apologise directly to those he offended, then you say the right thing is to publicly apologise.

Kind of confusing!


One can do both, and simultaneously. I never said privately.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:38 pm 
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Herb Tarlik wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
Herb Tarlik wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
How do you know he hasn't?


If you publicly castigate someone, the honorable thing to do is to publicly apologize. I dont know if he has done so in private but I would be my money on it that he has not.


Sorry Herb, I don't get you. First you want him to apologise directly to those he offended, then you say the right thing is to publicly apologise.

Kind of confusing!


One can do both, and simultaneously. I never said privately.


Ok, this makes more sense!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:41 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it.

Agreed, that's what's been discussed here if you didn't get it.

mikeyg123 wrote:
People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


Ah, ok. So people can only discuss stuff if they are more serious than what others have done in the past?

Got you.


I didn't see any sensitive souls here and it certainly doesn't matter if Max is an ultra talent or a De Cesaris. Max said some things, then backtracked and lied about it. That's what was pointed out. I don't see any pitchforks and no one asked for blood. We can still chat about what drivers say and do, right?


Just noiceable that people want to chat and criticise Verstappen for things they wouldn't even bring up about other drivers.

De Cesaris had talent. His problem was he couldn't keep it applied to the track!


Come on mikeyg123, you've been here long enough to know that this has happened before. The only other recent thread about swearing at authorities in public was Vettel's radio love message to Whiting last year. And that was discussed in the forum as well. Along with a poll of how Vettel should have been punished.


Are these he ony two times it's happened or the only two times it's inspired a thread?


What does this have to do? What's the difference to you?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:54 pm 
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Siao7 wrote:


What does this have to do? What's the difference to you?


Well my entire point was that Verstappen gets heavily criticised for behaviour that gets ignore or excused from others. So do you think that Verstappen and Vettel are the only two drivers in recent times to criticise the stewards? Or are they the only two drivers to get jumped on for it?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:26 pm 
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Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:32 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.


I don't feel like I have "vociferously" defended Verstappen on this issue. I think what he did was wrong and he has rightly apologised. I don't think his comments were as bad as Vettel's 12 months ago but I don't remember giving Vettel much criticism other than obviously pointing out his temperament cost him.

Perhaps It is me being too sensitive. I'm just fustrated at seeing somebody get disproportionately hammered for everything.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:39 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.

I'm with mikey123 on this one. There's a fair amount of schadenfreude going on in this thread and i think people are getting a bit holier than thou. Verstappen was a dick, but I'm not sure what's to be gained by digging out the tar and feathers. He's apologised. Yes, it was probably through clenched teeth but how's that different from most apologies that have happened from drivers in the past? I'll bet few were entirely voluntary. Think people should move on


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:42 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
Blake wrote:
Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.

I'm with mikey123 on this one. There's a fair amount of schadenfreude going on in this thread and i think people are getting a bit holier than thou. Verstappen was a dick, but I'm not sure what's to be gained by digging out the tar and feathers. He's apologised. Yes, it was probably through clenched teeth but how's that different from most apologies that have happened from drivers in the past? I'll bet few were entirely voluntary. Think people should move on


:nod:


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:43 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:51 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.


Wow. Talk about a classless guy. To use such vile language in defense of a clear rule infraction is just despicable.

I would hope that the FIA would give him a race ban for this. Of course they wont. Anything is tolerable for them. But I think he should be made an example of.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:54 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.

I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.

Yep. His comments were more offensive than anything from other drivers (with the possible exception of Seb in Mexico) and his apology was lacking. He basically took the old schoolyard apology - I'm sorry you were offended, but I'm still right.

There's nothing in his apology that really admits he did anything wrong, and I get the distinct feeling he doesn't think he did.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:57 pm 
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[quote="Zoue"][quote="Blake"]Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.[/quote]
I'm with mikey123 on this one. There's a fair amount of schadenfreude going on in this thread and i think people are getting a bit holier than thou. Verstappen was a dick, but I'm not sure what's to be gained by digging out the tar and feathers. He's apologised. Yes, it was probably through clenched teeth but how's that different from most apologies that have happened from drivers in the past? I'll bet few were entirely voluntary. Think people should move on[/quote]

Zoue & Mikey... i have a question for both of you. You know I respect your opinions, even though I might not agree with them. The question... "did Max really apologize?" All I see is an apology for the word he used. Did he apologize to Connelly (or a mystery steward) for calling him names? Did he apologize for sayong people should stay away form grand prix?

I don't see those apologies, but maybe I missed them. If he didn't, why is it wrong for people to expect him to do so? Why a "pass" for Max's behavior?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:57 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.

er, what?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:00 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.


I'm confused about the comment about Hamilton confronting Verstappen personally but that is indeed a hugely inappropriate comment from Max which I was not aware of. He does have a temper and does get emotional. However, as a driver, I think on recent evidence he's already right at the sharpest end.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:01 pm 
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Exediron wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.

I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.

Yep. His comments were more offensive than anything from other drivers (with the possible exception of Seb in Mexico) and his apology was lacking. He basically took the old schoolyard apology - I'm sorry you were offended, but I'm still right.

There's nothing in his apology that really admits he did anything wrong, and I get the distinct feeling he doesn't think he did.


I might be wrong but I was given the impression that in Dutch that expression doesn't have the same connotations as it would in English. I was led to believe it was a way of calling someone an idiot rather than having any offensive lin to Downs syndrome as it does in England. Obviously if that is not true then it is a very classless thing to say.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:01 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Blake wrote:
Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.

I'm with mikey123 on this one. There's a fair amount of schadenfreude going on in this thread and i think people are getting a bit holier than thou. Verstappen was a dick, but I'm not sure what's to be gained by digging out the tar and feathers. He's apologised. Yes, it was probably through clenched teeth but how's that different from most apologies that have happened from drivers in the past? I'll bet few were entirely voluntary. Think people should move on


Zoue & Mikey... i have a question for both of you. You know I respect your opinions, even though I might not agree with them. The question... "did Max really apologize?" All I see is an apology for the word he used. Did he apologize to Connelly (or a mystery steward) for calling him names? Did he apologize for sayong people should stay away form grand prix?

I don't see those apologies, but maybe I missed them. If he didn't, why is it wrong for people to expect him to do so? Why a "pass" for Max's behavior?

It's not a pass. I think he's been a complete idiot. But I'm not sure what people expect from apologies, really. Do they think he's going to appear on TV weeping and begging forgiveness? He's arrogant, but he's not the first driver to be arrogant and feel he's done no wrong. Call me a cynic but I'd say drivers who look really contrite are probably just better actors. I don't really get the whole self-flagellation thing, tbh. Just accept that he's an idiot


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:03 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Exediron wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.

I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.

Yep. His comments were more offensive than anything from other drivers (with the possible exception of Seb in Mexico) and his apology was lacking. He basically took the old schoolyard apology - I'm sorry you were offended, but I'm still right.

There's nothing in his apology that really admits he did anything wrong, and I get the distinct feeling he doesn't think he did.


I might be wrong but I was given the impression that in Dutch that expression doesn't have the same connotations as it would in English. I was led to believe it was a way of calling someone an idiot rather than having any offensive lin to Downs syndrome as it does in England. Obviously if that is not true then it is a very classless thing to say.



Good point. That needs to be considered.

Still - shows a lack of awareness but indeed if it's not true then it was a very classless thing to say. But I have no doubt that Max will learn and grow from this incident. He's already grown a lot over the last couple of years, especially as a racer.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:05 pm 
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Invade wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.


I'm confused about the comment about Hamilton confronting Verstappen personally but that is indeed a hugely inappropriate comment from Max which I was not aware of. He does have a temper and does get emotional. However, as a driver, I think on recent evidence he's already right at the sharpest end.



Never mind. I get it now.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:06 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Blake wrote:
Mikey, there is some being very sensitive here... it is you!

I don't know how many have publically insulted an official such as Seb and Max have done, if some did to the same extent, I suspect we would have heard about it... and guess what... it would have been a topic of conversation, in the forum and elsewhere.

Were you this protective of Vettel when his tirade brought him considerable and not unjustified grief in here? I sure don't remember you so vociferously defending Seb. Please don't give me the Max age thing as that has nothing to do with making a proper apology once one has cooled down.

Max is fully capable of knowing what is right and acting appropriately. In this case he has not really done right, just a quick attempt to sweep it all under the rug and move on.

I'm with mikey123 on this one. There's a fair amount of schadenfreude going on in this thread and i think people are getting a bit holier than thou. Verstappen was a dick, but I'm not sure what's to be gained by digging out the tar and feathers. He's apologised. Yes, it was probably through clenched teeth but how's that different from most apologies that have happened from drivers in the past? I'll bet few were entirely voluntary. Think people should move on


Zoue & Mikey... i have a question for both of you. You know I respect your opinions, even though I might not agree with them. The question... "did Max really apologize?" All I see is an apology for the word he used. Did he apologize to Connelly (or a mystery steward) for calling him names? Did he apologize for sayong people should stay away form grand prix?

I don't see those apologies, but maybe I missed them. If he didn't, why is it wrong for people to expect him to do so? Why a "pass" for Max's behavior?


I don't know if he has apologised directly to the steward or not. and neither does anyone else on this forum commenting. Personally, and I have said this before on this forum, I thin public apologies are pretty worthless. Rarely anything more than posturing and grandstanding. The saying people should stay away thing is a bit of fluff IMO. Angry petulance. It attacks nobody. I mean who would he even address that particular apology too?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:09 pm 
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Invade wrote:
Invade wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.


I'm confused about the comment about Hamilton confronting Verstappen personally but that is indeed a hugely inappropriate comment from Max which I was not aware of. He does have a temper and does get emotional. However, as a driver, I think on recent evidence he's already right at the sharpest end.



Never mind. I get it now.

can you help me out then?!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:12 pm 
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(deleting the quote mess)


It must be a reference to Nicolas Hamilton's cerebral palsy - while not the same condition there are similarities.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:19 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.

er, what?


Lewis Hamilton's brother Nicolas Hamilton has cerebral palsy.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 7:20 pm 
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Invade wrote:
(deleting the quote mess)


It must be a reference to Nicolas Hamilton's cerebral palsy - while not the same condition there are similarities.

ah, I see. Thanks


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:11 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
A lot of very sensitive souls on this thread. Verstappen was silly and petulant. Thats about it. People have said far worse. I don't know what it is about people with ultra talent that makes otherd so delight in criticising their every indiscretion. I can see Verstappen is becoming the new Hamilton.


I wasn't going to push this but his comments on Dutch TV were truly dreadful and offensive and needed a significant apology.

On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.

Suggesting a parallel with Hamilton in terms of behaviour is crazy and I would suggest many including Hamilton would be hugely offended. In fact credit to Hamilton for not confronting Verstappen personally. Its an immature and thoughtless playground reaction.

He may be talented but he has got a very long way to go as both a person and a driver.
There's another side to this that I can't shake off. I saw Max twice after the race; waiting in the anteroom, from where he was asked to leave. At that moment, he wasn't angry. If he had really been angry, I doubt he would have had that tight smile on his face. (I thought at the time that it was a "knowing smile", because there simply was no way he could have been ignorant about having left the track and having made an illegal overtake. It might happen if you just miss contact with the white line by an inch or two, but these drivers know when they are more than 30cms off the track.)
The second time was during the TV interview with Dutch sports channel Ziggo. Max was smiling, not in a rage at all. The interviewer called the steward a d***head, and Max called him a mongoloid.
The fact that I didn't see Max to be mad at all, makes me doubt he said things in the heat of the moment. It seemed to contrived to me to have been anything but an act; playing to his audience which is incapable of seeing fault.

If I'm wrong, and Max really didn't, and possibly still doesn't, understand that he was wrong to cut the corner, and even more wrong to call a very specific person an outrageous name, then I will have to put the respect he had started to earn from me on ice. The weak apology he posted means nothing without a personal one to the steward in question, and an acknowledgement that the man and his colleagues were bang on correct about the penalty.

And let's not forget all those other people backing Max up after the race. I'm not sure what scares me most. Max's sad opportunism, or the support from people like Horner, Lauda etc. I simply could not believe my eyes and ears. Somebody should remind these millionaires there's a sport hidden beneath all their whipped up drama. Or at least there used to be.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 1:11 am 
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pendulumeffect wrote:
Is it me or are comments like this likely to mothball a promising career? Surely if even if Max was wrongly penalized, making a statement like this is just going to hamper his career in the long run?

There must be a lot of businessmen in the Liberty Media chair board thinking hmmm maybe we should start finding the next big thing already before this guy blows everything? Let's just put more decisions against him in the future so he quietly fades away.....

Or has Max already reached the Alonso/Vettel/Hamilton/Trump status of whatever he says or does can only make him more famous and immune to punishment?



He's a kid. Yes it was a stupid thing to say, but he's only just 20 years old.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 1:19 am 
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TheBlackFlag wrote:
pendulumeffect wrote:
Is it me or are comments like this likely to mothball a promising career? Surely if even if Max was wrongly penalized, making a statement like this is just going to hamper his career in the long run?

There must be a lot of businessmen in the Liberty Media chair board thinking hmmm maybe we should start finding the next big thing already before this guy blows everything? Let's just put more decisions against him in the future so he quietly fades away.....

Or has Max already reached the Alonso/Vettel/Hamilton/Trump status of whatever he says or does can only make him more famous and immune to punishment?



He's a kid. Yes it was a stupid thing to say, but he's only just 20 years old.


Yes. he is a "kid". However, to molly-coddle him does him no service either. Sometimes a "kid" needs to be made to understand the consequences of his action... call it tough love if you will. Last year, as a rookie, he was excused his very erratic defensive moves because he was a "kid". This "kid" can be excused the outburst, and we could even live with his what appears to me, less than understanding apology, but while some here almost resent those of us who have called him to task, using the "so young" reasoning, one must ask when does he quit getting a pass. I see at least one poster is basically saying that is just who he is. live with it, embrace it or whatever. funny, that is what the "trumpies" are saying too.
;)

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 9:25 am 
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TheBlackFlag wrote:
pendulumeffect wrote:
Is it me or are comments like this likely to mothball a promising career? Surely if even if Max was wrongly penalized, making a statement like this is just going to hamper his career in the long run?

There must be a lot of businessmen in the Liberty Media chair board thinking hmmm maybe we should start finding the next big thing already before this guy blows everything? Let's just put more decisions against him in the future so he quietly fades away.....

Or has Max already reached the Alonso/Vettel/Hamilton/Trump status of whatever he says or does can only make him more famous and immune to punishment?



He's a kid. Yes it was a stupid thing to say, but he's only just 20 years old.


In Europe at 18 years you are a man. His parents have enough money to give him a decent education, he has excellent peers. Is he a kid or does he just behave like one?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 1:06 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
TheBlackFlag wrote:
pendulumeffect wrote:
Is it me or are comments like this likely to mothball a promising career? Surely if even if Max was wrongly penalized, making a statement like this is just going to hamper his career in the long run?

There must be a lot of businessmen in the Liberty Media chair board thinking hmmm maybe we should start finding the next big thing already before this guy blows everything? Let's just put more decisions against him in the future so he quietly fades away.....

Or has Max already reached the Alonso/Vettel/Hamilton/Trump status of whatever he says or does can only make him more famous and immune to punishment?



He's a kid. Yes it was a stupid thing to say, but he's only just 20 years old.


In Europe at 18 years you are a man. His parents have enough money to give him a decent education, he has excellent peers. Is he a kid or does he just behave like one?


I don't think many 20 year old males actually act like "men". I know I certainly didn't!


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:05 pm 
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Unfortunate yes. Immature, yes? Likely to scuttle a career. Not a chance, not a single one, in a million years. Get real about the Star/Money industrial complex. The complex needs stars and he's the newest brightest one. They need him.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:19 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.


If true, then I just lost a lot of respect for Max as a human being

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:33 pm 
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Max is already in... and it is not his fault.
He should have never been allowed to drive an F1 car at 17 years old.

He can do whatever he wants and all you will hear is "he is a kid", "he will learn".
Of course he feels omnipotent being the youngest and geniusest(his opinion) of all the drivers.
F1/FIA has shot itself in the foot with all this mess and it is just the beginning.

Championships wins in lower categories MUST be mandatory to drive in F1 for top teams(just like in MotoGp) and I have no idea how Red Bull was allowed to do what they did.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:34 pm 
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purchville wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.


If true, then I just lost a lot of respect for Max as a human being


How good is your Dutch?



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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:52 pm 
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purchville wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.


If true, then I just lost a lot of respect for Max as a human being


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 2:55 pm 
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purchville wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.


If true, then I just lost a lot of respect for Max as a human being


As I said earlier in the thread the word does not have the same connotationsin Dutch. It's just a way of saying someone is an idiot. And Max was speaking in Dutch when he said it. I very much doubt Max would have been aware of the idiomwhen translated to English.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:03 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
purchville wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
On Dutch tv, in an official interview for the broadcaster, Max Verstappen called the steward ‘een mongool’ i.e. someone with Downs syndrome.


If true, then I just lost a lot of respect for Max as a human being


As I said earlier in the thread the word does not have the same connotationsin Dutch. It's just a way of saying someone is an idiot. And Max was speaking in Dutch when he said it. I very much doubt Max would have been aware of the idiomwhen translated to English.

BIB is the same way it was used in English speaking countries.

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