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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:59 pm 
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Good point about the wider rear ends, caught Kubica out in his first test too.

Vettel actually overtakes Schumacher in that clip then they run alongside one another for a bit, then Vettel is barely ahead and then nearly level again by corner entry. Vettel does the same thing, apex's the corner a bit too much with a car on the inside. I think Schumacher just wanted to pull alongside to give him a wave.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:06 pm 
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Thank god for back to back races.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:52 pm 
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Zoue wrote:
I would suggest the opposite, that the task here appears to be to lay the blame at Vettel's feet.

None of the other outlets I have seen say anything (yet). It seems they have moved on

No I only jumped in when I saw the usual pattern of laying blame on anyone but Vettel himself and totally putting the blame on Stroll, even though the stewards judged a portion of blame on both drivers.

Do you think that Vettel was 100% blameless?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:06 pm 
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lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk

Vettel waving to the crowd, not looking in his mirrors and nearly hitting another car, but i'm told after the flag drivers always look in their mirrors, and Vettel a world champion at that, but let's pick on the 18 year old kid because Vettel yet again did nothing wrong.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:12 pm 
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Fiki wrote:
lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk
It may well be, but I think it worth bearing in mind that Schumacher is moving alongside a driver who is saluting the crowd, after becoming world champion again. If I understand some of the comments in this thread correctly, it was the overtaker who has to look out, not the picker-upper-of-marbles, or in this case the celebrating champion.

I believe, as somebody pointed out after Singapore, that the wider rear wheels may well be a factor that some drivers find harder to compensate for.

The overtaker did look out and avoided Vettel's car, also what helped is that the 2 cars were going at close to the same speed, and I would say that what didn't help was the 2 cars having to negotiate a corner, on a straight you don't have the same problem.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:12 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk

Vettel waving to the crowd, not looking in his mirrors and nearly hitting another car, but i'm told after the flag drivers always look in their mirrors, and Vettel a world champion at that, but let's pick on the 18 year old kid because Vettel yet again did nothing wrong.


Vettel made a mistake there, just like Stroll made a mistake in Malaysia. Drivers should always look in the mirrors, racing or not.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:25 pm 
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SmoothRide wrote:
pokerman wrote:
lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk

Vettel waving to the crowd, not looking in his mirrors and nearly hitting another car, but i'm told after the flag drivers always look in their mirrors, and Vettel a world champion at that, but let's pick on the 18 year old kid because Vettel yet again did nothing wrong.


Vettel made a mistake there, just like Stroll made a mistake in Malaysia. Drivers should always look in the mirrors, racing or not.

The point is that obviously they don't always look in their mirrors, this seems to be a double standard were Vettel himself doesn't look in his mirrors then accuses someone else of doing the same thing, a rule of thumb perhaps should be that after the flag drivers should proceed with caution back into the pits, did Vettel proceed with caution?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:16 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
pokerman wrote:
lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk

Vettel waving to the crowd, not looking in his mirrors and nearly hitting another car, but i'm told after the flag drivers always look in their mirrors, and Vettel a world champion at that, but let's pick on the 18 year old kid because Vettel yet again did nothing wrong.


Vettel made a mistake there, just like Stroll made a mistake in Malaysia. Drivers should always look in the mirrors, racing or not.

The point is that obviously they don't always look in their mirrors, this seems to be a double standard were Vettel himself doesn't look in his mirrors then accuses someone else of doing the same thing, a rule of thumb perhaps should be that after the flag drivers should proceed with caution back into the pits, did Vettel proceed with caution?

I think the double standards are pretty evident when you're blaming Vettel in both situations?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 7:52 pm 
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Covalent wrote:
pokerman wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
pokerman wrote:
lamo wrote:
I think spatial awareness is definitely a Vettel weakness. Found this clip by accident when watching Perez's joke to his engineer that his engine had failed on the last lap in Suzuka 2011. Vettel turns in on Schumacher oblivious that he is there and MS has to run the kerb to avoid him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGv4yrmBVHk

Vettel waving to the crowd, not looking in his mirrors and nearly hitting another car, but i'm told after the flag drivers always look in their mirrors, and Vettel a world champion at that, but let's pick on the 18 year old kid because Vettel yet again did nothing wrong.


Vettel made a mistake there, just like Stroll made a mistake in Malaysia. Drivers should always look in the mirrors, racing or not.

The point is that obviously they don't always look in their mirrors, this seems to be a double standard were Vettel himself doesn't look in his mirrors then accuses someone else of doing the same thing, a rule of thumb perhaps should be that after the flag drivers should proceed with caution back into the pits, did Vettel proceed with caution?

I think the double standards are pretty evident when you're blaming Vettel in both situations?

But I didn't blame Vettel in the first instance, that was just a prime example of how drivers often don't look in their mirrors after the flag, the race is over and if you feel the need to pass you pass with caution.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:18 am 
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Ok fair enough I misunderstood that post.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:56 pm 
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Some further comment from Charlie Whiting on Ted's notebook @ 13:29

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXbrXCo ... ploademail


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 5:53 pm 
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jiminwatford wrote:
Some further comment from Charlie Whiting on Ted's notebook @ 13:29

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXbrXCo ... ploademail

Yeah so basically the race was over so no need to put the steering wheel back on, like I said 10 pages ago in the fifth reply in the thread :-P

Edited for autocorrect correct.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:45 am 
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Covalent wrote:
jiminwatford wrote:
Some further comment from Charlie Whiting on Ted's notebook @ 13:29

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXbrXCo ... ploademail

Yeah so basically the race was over so no need to put the steering wheel back on, like I said 10 pages ago in the fifth reply in the thread :-P

Edited for autocorrect correct.


Acknowledging that is not near as fun as 9 pages of Vettel condemnations over virtually nothing, Cov. Even to the point of creating yet another Vettel post race bash thread for emphasis!!!

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:48 am 
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Blake wrote:
Covalent wrote:
jiminwatford wrote:
Some further comment from Charlie Whiting on Ted's notebook @ 13:29

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXbrXCo ... ploademail

Yeah so basically the race was over so no need to put the steering wheel back on, like I said 10 pages ago in the fifth reply in the thread :-P

Edited for autocorrect correct.


Acknowledging that is not near as fun as 9 pages of Vettel condemnations over virtually nothing, Cov. Even to the point of creating yet another Vettel post race bash thread for emphasis!!!

Yes quite sad really.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:21 am 
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Not been here for the last few days so won't dig up all the replies to my posts, as the Vettel-Stroll case has been done to death, but I sure hope everyone noticed Alonso passing Massa closely in a corner on the cooldown lap this past weekend.

That would put the "why did Vettel have to overtake" and "why did he have to do it in a corner" questions to bed as well as the notion that this is somehow "not meant to be done". Drivers do this all the time.

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